Cairn: Session Zero

Wherein we chat about what we want out of the game, lines and veils, the implied setting, etc.

One thing I like less about Cairn 2e vs. the original version of the game is that there’s a lot more implied setting in the random chargen tables and the archetypes.

Who all has the game? I’ll share what’s needed, but author Yochai Gal has provided the PDF for free. Curious to hear people’s takes on the (fairly whimsical) implied setting. Dark, miserabilist OSR this is not.

Also curious to know what OSR adventures people have either already played through, or have interest in…

Hi! I own both editions of the game. And yeah there’s a lot of setting baked into the random tables and archetypes. But I kind of like it! Just like I like OSE and Dolmenwood. I like that fey, folklore flavor. I’m fine with not using it in our game though and making our own setting, too.

As for lines and veils, mine are mostly covered by the site’s rules. So for lines, no real world racism, homophobia, transphobia, sexism. Fantasy racism is ok. I also want to veil harm to young children.

For this game, I’m hoping to have an OSR experience and get to know Cairn. Looking forward to it!

I agree with @Drgwen on lines & veils. I'd add a veil for over sexualized content.

I have the PDF and I am good with altering the setting however you see fit.

I've not run or played many OSR adventures, so it's probably a safe bet I haven't seen whatever you're considering if you're looking at a published adventure.

I actually sort of like the setting as is described in the wardens guide. It's mostly the character creation results that bother me. They feel much too goofy and out of place for the setting. The world generation tables in the wardens guide also tripped me up while I was trying them out. They really do not produce something that fits the implied setting very well.

It's probably going to be fine with me. I would have some backgrounds that I would be interested in playing, assuming we play the setting as is. But if we want do to something else I am on board with that.

The previously stated lines & veils work for me as well!

I've gathered the Core Rules on cairnrpg.com. I'll check for the PDF as well.

For the setting, I do like that it's not so dark, though that can be fun as well. I am happy with making a new setting or fleshing out the original one.

So far, I have tried Mausritter and Tales of Argosa. I'm still interested in Mork Borg one day as it seems very popular, but want to focus on learning Cairn 2e for now as it is one I see very often referenced on Reddit. I think I'll start checking out the ones everyone has listed as favorites in the OOC thread as well!

Nothing to add on lines and veils.

I’m open to a more whimsical setting, but happy with a darker or more realistic twist if that’s the preference. I think the only specific OSR module I’ve run is Winters Daughter (takes place in Dolmenwood) - so you have a pretty free hand from my side.

The Symbaroum setting does something interesting with their dark forest, by having it actively resisting human exploitation of its resources and plunder of its ruins through corrupted beasts and such - a bit like in Princess Mononoke. Curious if others would like to add some naturalist conflict like this on top of what Cairn has to offer.

I kind of read the Cairn setting like that. With the forests being sentient things and gates to the roots not being closable once opened. There is a vaguely sciencey religion that is fighting the more folksy faiths. It kind of reminds me a bit of Thief the Dark Project, but set in the countryside rather than a city.

Alright, catching up here too… (And still on vacation, then have that con to hit, but I think it’ll be good to just keep the conversation flowing.)

A Few Things…
Lines & Veils
Sounds like we’re all aligned.

Lines: Sexual assault; real-world racism, homophobia, transphobia, sexism. Tropey fantasy discrimination okay if handled the right way.
Veils: Harm to young children, overly sexualized content. Graphic torture.

Vald (The Default Cairn 2e Setting) & Character Creation
Sounds like we’re all basically on board here as well, though I agree with Aline that some of the chargen stuff doesn’t quite mesh as well as it might with the setting. I say let’s go for the default setting, and tweak any character backgrounds, traits, bonds, omens or equipment that we feel doesn’t fit.

For those that are pretty new to the OSR, there are a couple of schools of thought regarding characters: one is that you should basically roll 3d6 ‘down the line’ (in order) and then just pick as class and play that PC. Who they are will emerge through play. The other, typified by games like Into the Odd, Knave and Cairn, give the players lots of quirky little bits to grab onto — personality traits, looks, debts, etc. This latter approach is what we’ll be using for this game, but one thing I always offer up in games where you’re presented with a bunch of random tables at character generation is the option to choose the entry you’re most interested in, or to roll twice and select the more interesting option.

For the record, my normal mode of play for the OSR is much darker, bloodier, and nastier. I love Dolmenwood and the whole dangerous fae vibe that also resonates in Vald, but my games are usually light on whimsy and heavier on difficult situations that require difficult decision-making. (Symbaroum is a favorite setting of mine btw.) I’ll shift gears a bit here and try to follow the spirit of what Gal is laying down…

Oh, and on an adventure — I want to see who the characters are / how they come out… then I’ll pick or come up with something.

Sounds great! And I’m 100% cool with random rolling, even the weird quirks. I reserve the right to veto something if it makes me uncomfortable, but I tend to play my OSR characters in the same way I might drive a stolen car — take them in a joyride and, if I crash, that’s all part of the fun. I am good with dark or whimsical as well, but I want my darkness to be interesting and creative, not dark for grim darkness’ sake. I don’t play games that are like pizza cutters — all edge and no point.

Looking forward to playing!

I think we’re fine, but keep me honest — I like the pizza cutter analogy. I’m no edgelord, but with some very notable exceptions (Superhero games, space opera, etc.) I generally far per my fantasy low, grounded, realistic and dirty.

I'm excited to play!

I have rolled up a completely, 100% random character with mostly dismal stats -- a Strength of 5, only 6 starting gold, etc. And a... Rill Runner??? Sure, ok I'll give it a shot. But I draw the line at BALD. No, she WILL have hair. Sorry not sorry!

Sounds good, will have a look when I can.

Also, I’ll post a character sheet in the next few days for everyone to use / submit…

Oh, and if you haven’t seen yet — I’ve put individual chargen threads up for each of you.

Appreciate the guidance to character creation and the wiggle room. Curious, for inventory slots, do they include equipped inventory like the armor and weapon? Take your time on the character sheet since you are still quite busy.

They do, and I will be upfront in telling you my experiences with Cairn 2e suggest that the inventory system is broken. Or at a minimum, not that fun. Let’s try it RAW, and adjust if things look really wonky.

The inventory system is one thing about Cairn that I've been curious to see in action. Adding Fatigue to inventory seems a little odd to me, but I've not experienced it in play.

I think the system itself is fine if a touch fiddly — more fun live than in PbP. The issue is that there aren’t enough slots, slot 10 filled makes you encumbered, and you cannot carry more!

I've heard one hack of this is to say that items worn and wielded don't count toward Inventory. But I am 100% fine with using it as written as well!

Indeed — it’s easy enough to fix (thought that hack circumvents the fact that you have specific hand and body slots), but let’s see how it all feels when the PCs are pulled together.