[OOC] General Discussion

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Mar 13, 2020 4:22 am
I just hope that those command can include more than one thing at a time.

Like telling the drone to reach and explode or a car to drive to some coordinates without having to specify every turns and stops.
Mar 13, 2020 4:30 am
Yes I totally think it should be so. The drones have their own Pilot ratings after all. So if you command a drone to attack, it should subsume moving towards the target in order to attack, no need to specify move and attack as separate commands. Or if you command a drone to chase, that should just be one command, not separate ones for each turn and stop.
Mar 21, 2020 10:02 am
We've stalled a bit this week, both my posts and well as some of yours. I'll use this weekend to do a quick refresh, and that'll include advancing the plot a little for some of you. Don't want you to be stuck in the sea / airport / hotel room / train station for the next two PbP months.

Thanks for pursuing your chapter 0s so far, don't mind me as I try to engineer to bring the team together!
Mar 21, 2020 11:13 am
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Last edited March 21, 2020 11:13 am
Mar 21, 2020 12:32 pm
Keep up the good work !!
Mar 27, 2020 9:06 pm
How's everybody doing ?
Mar 27, 2020 9:51 pm
just peachy
Mar 28, 2020 12:31 pm
Hi everyone, it's been a two week break in this game (although I share other games with most of you, and still see you and play on in them). This is for two reasons, and one will affect the other:

1. Work during this pandemic has been way busier. I teach college, and they haven't closed schools in my country, so we're teaching extra classes and essentially holding the fort by keeping schools open so that we don't have to shut down the workplaces (necessary - if kids stay home, then adults need to as well, as we're trying to avoid a lockdown). So I have less time on my hands, but am still playing and GMing for hours on GP, because well, I'm an RPGer at heart.

2. SR6 takes a lot of time to run properly. While I'm no stranger to rules-heavy crunchy systems, and while my entire story and NPCs have been outlined and DM notes all in place, I still find myself cross-checking back and forth across the rulebook to make sure nothing contradicts. And in many places it does, or is unclear, or just plain incomplete. And I find I have to do this a lot. This is a major time-sink. As a DM, I can make it up or house rule it if I want to, but that's messy and creates problems for players expecting rules to run a certain way, and then having to redo actions just because we've had to change things.
We've run this game for three months, and one of my initial objectives was to playtest this new edition. I've reviewed all our posts thus far, and in truth we've spent as much time discussing and clarifying the rules as we have playing the game (not that I didn't enjoy the discussions). I am inclined to conclude as a DM that this system will continue to be as tedious to run and will require a major investment (on average, posts here take me three to four times as long to prepare as, say, the D&D5e game I'm currently running).

Based on what I still want to do on GP (which includes playing new games and running at least one or two more games), I have two proposals:

The first is to retire the game. I feel as if I've given SR6 a fair run, and do not intend to continue with this system.

The second is to porting the entire story over to a new game system. This will mean learning a new game system for some of you, and starting the character creation process from scratch. If we do this, please suggest what system might work (my preliminary thoughts on this find no compatible cyberpunk system that also does magic though).

Let me know your thoughts on this. I'll wait to make sure I hear from everyone. If it helps, I can create your next posts, just so you know where we're at in terms of story and where we'll pick up from if we restart.
Mar 28, 2020 1:31 pm
Personnally, the worst solution would be to retire the game. The story is great and I'd really like to see where it goes. It wouldn't be my first time changing the system in the middle of a game so I have no problem with that. And new systems in my opinion are always fun to try. If you'd like a suggestion for an easy enough system that can do cyber, magic and pretty much what you'd like, savage world would be my pick. (Make sure it's the SWADE edition)
Mar 28, 2020 2:55 pm
I'll gladly change system. We tried SR6e I think its less clunky then 5e, but it is still clunky. If Savage Worlds can do the trick, then I'm fin by chanting to that system.
Mar 28, 2020 3:20 pm
Here's a link for those that would like to take a look at it...https://thetrove.net/Books/Savage%20Worlds/_Core/SWADE/SWADE%20-%20Core%20Rulebook%20%28v5.4%29.pdf
Last edited March 28, 2020 3:45 pm
Mar 28, 2020 3:25 pm
I have no issue learning new system, however I am worried it may not solve much of the issues.

Firstly, adapting a new system not made for Shadowrun potentially could be as much time consuming as adapting the current one.

Second, and maybe most relevant, the setting itself may be the issue here. While I love the Shadowrun world, I actually never saw a SR game actually work properly unless it's a series of simplified runs. Once you start playing with the social and political, it quickly become an extremely complex and unforgiving world for the characters. Add to that the more limited mean of transferring information in pbp and you have players who start second guessing their every moves to avoid a faux pas that their character would either know better or is not ready to deal with the consequences.

T.l.d.r
I'll wait to have a look at the new system before deciding.

No matter the system, focusing more on character intentions rather than step by step action would be my suggestion, because it is impossible to expect the player to really understand all the details of what the character knows and notice naturally.
Mar 29, 2020 2:25 pm
Okay I have not run SR6e but I ran and played its earlier versions as well as a myriad of other systems. I do not think SR6e is any better or worse then any other system but saying I also state that I have learned to accept a system for what it is and what it is not and either work within the boundaries of what it is and/or tweak the system to make it work for what I am striving to achieve.

First off we know that SR6e was a quick and incomplete solution to a problem perceived in the earlier versions okay so be it. However, I would be more inclined to fill that gaps in this version by either borrowing and/or modifying and/or enhancing those aspects from the earlier versions that would help to fill these gaps and make this game more complete. Heck the game designers may even borrow (or freely steal if you like a more precise term for it) the concepts and solutions we end up coming up with. Having helped other games in fixing their designs I think this one has solid potential.

Conversely as has been pointed out... SR as is stands works better with a cohesive group tasked for one-shot missions. This is something I understood when I designed my games as this helped to limit the world issues that currently plague this game. Things characters ought to know that they are either unaware of or just forgot about.

Personally I do not care what system we end up choosing to use as to me all of them have their pros/cons however I like the other players do strongly feel that this story has extreme potential as such I would greatly much enjoy continuing forward with it. If you are done playing by the incomplete rules of SR6e and are ready to expand well you have a game designer in your corner willing to dedicate time with you in fleshing out those areas where issues actually reside and coming up with balanced guidelines that allot for these issues and yet maintain the purpose of the game which is to make it fun to play. Which generally means enough crunchiness that maintains the fences needed while enough gates to allow for the freedom that is needed. It is a delicate balance and the more current (or realistic) the world is the harder it is to maintain that balance.

Look forward to seeing where you choose to go because in the end the game must be fun for the Story Teller as well and if it has become more of a chore than fun we need to alleviate that issue at all costs. Unless of course you choose to close it down ;)
Last edited March 29, 2020 2:33 pm
Mar 29, 2020 6:04 pm
I like option 2 but have no ideas on another system but I'd be more than willing to learn one
Mar 30, 2020 11:20 am
I'm in an IRL group where we play Shadowrun with Blades In The Dark rule adaptation. Is good for crew play, might not be the best system for play-by-post

I also google around and found a FATE adoptation
Mar 30, 2020 1:17 pm
Thanks for weighing in everyone, just going to check in on @falconloft for his view, before I make my comments.
Mar 31, 2020 5:01 pm
I would be fine with swapping systems, but I'm not a big fan of Savage Worlds at all. I plan on never playing that system again if I can help it. That's just my opinion, and if they group ultimately decides to go that direction, I would not have any hard feelings for that decision.

Personally, I'd like to play in a Sixth World game sometime. BitD would be interesting but I'm not sure how you'd hack it to be SR. It's been a long time since I've played FATE. It's not one of my favorites either, but I'd give it a shot.
Last edited March 31, 2020 5:02 pm
Mar 31, 2020 5:46 pm
Ooo Fate would be rather tricky I would think - not undoable just tricky. Do not know about Sixth World. Still I really feel that SR6e Augmented would work just fine ;) but as stated earlier I am willing to go with the flow on this.
Last edited March 31, 2020 5:47 pm
Mar 31, 2020 7:51 pm
Honestly, there's not really anything that 6e is missing; it just doesn't fit everyone's idea of Shadowrun. No edition ever has. Trying to 'fix' it would just result in a horrible hodge-podge of house rules that try to change the world more than they do the system. (See the linguasoft conversation for an example of why that's not a good idea.)
Mar 31, 2020 8:00 pm
Not really I think you have taken the meaning a bit too far or too short -- basically as has been pointed out the current guidelines have been made more general in scope but the current problem is that it is in fact missing various guidelines that would allow it to be more complete for all types -- this has no relation to matching everyone's idea of Shadowrun but more implementing those elements that are part of the current shadowrun in a manner that adhere's to the current paradigm but creates a minimal amount of additional guidelines so that those things that folks would like to do can be done within a pre-outlined set of guidelines

For example there are currently no guidelines covering how one creates a spell from scratch which is obviously something that has to exist within the game since we already have some spells and yet the few that we do have do not cover all the aspects that one might want to cover with spells. Further I am 100% positive that there are several other aspects to the present game that actually exist but have not been addressed. This one I just know more about since that is the class type I am playing.
Last edited March 31, 2020 8:01 pm
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