Paying the Price (OOC)

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Mar 9, 2025 7:11 pm
Delirium says:
Emma never thinks she is way over her head ;) ...
Has that always been the case? Would Persephone remember this from college?
Mar 9, 2025 7:22 pm
Perfect!
Though I should also warn you (and @vagueGM know it too), that it's pretty hard to get Emma to apologize. It literally took extortion last time for her to fess up to her wrongdoing (and she still believes she was treated unfairly!).
vagueGM says:
Has that always been the case? Would Persephone remember this from college?
Emma hasn't changed much since college, but there is a difference between crashing a concert to breaking into vampire's lair
Mar 9, 2025 7:27 pm
I kind of love how you're playing the Aware as a fearless trouble magnet!
Mar 9, 2025 7:44 pm
Emma is definitely vain (I think I mentioned it when I introduced her, ooc). She is far from a full blown narcissist, and she obviously has empathy and compassion for other people, but it IS one of her character flaws.
Mar 9, 2025 7:50 pm
Drgwen says:
I kind of love how you're playing the Aware as a fearless trouble magnet!
Almost makes one want to add a few Monsterhearts moves "When you get kidnapped by monsters, mark XP" or was that Monster of the Week? Maybe the Monterhearts ones were "Excuses are my Armour: Then you ignore a blatant problem, mark experience" or "When you go poking your nose in affairs not meant for your kind, mark experience". :)
Mar 9, 2025 7:58 pm
vagueGM says:
"Excuses are my Armour: When you ignore a blatant problem, mark experience"
100% Monsterhearts "The Mortal"! Love it.
Mar 9, 2025 8:01 pm
Quote:
100% Monsterhearts "The Mortal"! Love it.
I should go check it out then ;) (never played Monsterhearts before, or even looked at the rules)
Mar 10, 2025 12:46 pm
Does Chablis now owe Emma and Pers a debt? It looks appropriate, and Emma might want to cash it pretty soonish.
Mar 10, 2025 1:36 pm
Delirium says:
Does Chablis now owe Emma and Pers a debt? It looks appropriate, ...
Emma? definitely. Chablis Owes Emma, mark it.

Persephone? I am not sure. Chablis did not feed from Persephone, in fact Persephone is the scary lady who put her in the closet, so I wouldn't say Persephone counted for Do Someone a Favor, as Emma did. Maybe we can consider Overlook a Harm for the —literal— 1-Harm if Persephone forgives that and we consider it a big enough deal, if it is just a scratch that will be alright in a few days then it is a rather small Debt; if there is lingering trauma and doubt, then it is bigger.

There is also the question of if Emma owes Debts: Kenedi will remember this favor and Cash It In at some point, but Bev —unless there is trouble with her work— would not consider it a big deal (she has her own reasons (curiosity)).

Persephone Owing Emma has many layers. Persephone came here of her own volition, so not really a Debt for that, right? Persephone got bitten as a direct result of her own choices to enter the bedroom, so not Emma's (direct) fault? The most likely cause of Emma Owing Persephone could be Overlook a Harm, both for 'look at the mess you got me into' and 'you were a bit of a bitch' [ref and before].

Thoughts?
Mar 10, 2025 2:23 pm
Since Emma would never have been able to help Chablis without Persephone incapacitating her first, and since Pers took an even greater personal risk than Emma did, I believe Pers does deserve a debt. Perhaps Chablis needs to be reminded of that first?

Emma already cashed in a debt when she called Bev in, so I don't think she should owe another one for her help. Taking a day off work and donating some blood is an inconvenience for sure, but not that huge that it would be worth multiple favors. And I don’t think Emma owes Kenedi a debt either, since she used ‘one way or another.’ Otherwise, Emma could have simply offered a debt directly, without the roll.
Mar 10, 2025 2:26 pm
I'd think that Persephone feels as if Emma owes her, both for putting her in harm's way and for "ignoring" her after the fact. Not sure if Chablis owes Persephone anything tho; even if she does, I don't think she'd understand why.
Mar 10, 2025 3:59 pm
Delirium says:
... Since Emma would never have been able to help Chablis without Persephone incapacitating her first, and since Pers took an even greater personal risk than Emma did, I believe Pers does deserve a debt. ...
That sounds like a Debt to Emma, though, not to Chablis? Persephone helped Emma, this led to Chablis Owing Emma. Does Chablis Owe Persephone for that? From her perspective Persephone was not helping her, and did feed her, right?
Delirium says:
... Perhaps Chablis needs to be reminded of that first? ...
Possibly?
Delirium says:
... Emma already cashed in a debt when she called Bev in, so I don't think she should owe another one for her help. ...
Agreed. Good point.
Delirium says:
... Taking a day off work and donating some blood is an inconvenience for sure ...
Only she did not 'take a day off', she left in a hurry, without (good) explanation, and stole hospital equipment (and blood, though you did not ask for this last part). If, in the course of further play, this costs her, you may well Owe her for this (see below).
Delirium says:
... I don’t think Emma owes Kenedi a debt either, since she used ‘one way or another.’ ...
Good point. I agree.
Delirium says:
... Otherwise, Emma could have simply offered a debt directly, without the roll. ...
You could have offered, yes. But asking her to leave work and give her own, personal, blood to a blood-sucking vampire is a BIG ASK, I am not at all sure that would have worked without your special ability to compel that action.

As with Bev —though less likely to come up— if this costs her down the road, she may feel you Owe her (see below).

Drgwen says:
... I'd think that Persephone feels as if Emma owes her, both for putting her in harm's way and for "ignoring" her after the fact. ...
I am inclined to agree, but that is for the players to work out between themselves.

I will just remind people that Debts, no matter which direction, are good for the player, they often end up being the prime driver of Advancement, especially in the later game, so take them on other players whenever you can. :)
Drgwen says:
... Not sure if Chablis owes Persephone anything tho; ...
I don't really see it, no.
Drgwen says:
... even if she does, I don't think she'd understand why. ...
Though that doesn't really matter. She will either have to learn to understand the ways of Debts or become an outcast in supernatural society. Emma is in the same boat, and Persephone also might not understand the full power of Debts? Your Dark Patron maybe have skimmed over this part in your orientation, as they are a source of power they hold over you, but they also know that you need to play your part else it reflects badly on them, so maybe you have been 'told', though 'told' is not the same as 'knowing'.

One good touchstone for if a Debt applies could be, when you come Cash it in, does the demand make sense?

Persephone saying to Chablis: "You remember that time I broke into your flat and scared the spit out of you, then tossed you in the closest? Now I want you to do me a favour." Would Chablis (as a rational woman) say: "Yeah, sure, I Owe you one."? Or would she be all: "Don't hurt me!"?
Compare that to Emma saying to Chablis: "You remember that time you were starving and I gave you some of my (delicious) blood to drink even though you attacked us? Now I need you to do me a favour." Very different tone.

Similarly, if nothing else happened, but Kenedi were to consider this favour Debt-worthy, she might call on Emma saying: "Remember that time I took off work and came to help you with the little vampire problem? Well, my car has broken down and I need you to come pick me up on you way home." Those two seem about on balance (she could not ask for something bigger than the original deed), but is a little petty for Debts, so this whole scenario does not count.

Compare that with Bev's potential of: "Remember that time I stole hospital equipment and left work for you. I got fired, now I need you to introduce me to < ... >." That would count. But she has not lost her job or gotten into trouble (yet) so we won't record it.

Make sense? Treat all the people like real people and parse the mechanics that way.
Mar 10, 2025 4:06 pm
That is an excellent way to think of Debts. Thanks for that!
Mar 10, 2025 11:21 pm
Hey, I’m back! I think Benji’s current scene was pretty much wrapped up so I’m happy to join the scene with Persephone and Emma whenever needed!
Mar 11, 2025 12:18 pm
Excellent!

Emma was just about to phone you [ref]. We can make that happen.

Tell me when you want Benji to notice he has lost a day. :)
Mar 11, 2025 10:28 pm
vagueGM says:
Tell me when you want Benji to notice he has lost a day. :)
Oh! Are we saying this conversation is happening the same day Benji spoke to Teddy and Fawcett then?
Mar 11, 2025 10:32 pm
oopsylon says:
vagueGM says:
Tell me when you want Benji to notice he has lost a day. :)
Oh! Are we saying this conversation is happening the same day Benji spoke to Teddy and Fawcett then?
No, that was, like, a day ago. For instance: if you spoke to them on Monday morning it is now Tuesday morning, but but you did not notice the time pass.

This is mainly to catch you up, but also 'for reasons' in the story. Jacob could tell you about it... but he is out of contact.
Mar 11, 2025 10:44 pm
vagueGM says:
No, that was, like, a day ago. For instance: if you spoke to them on Monday morning it is now Tuesday morning, but but you did not notice the time pass.

This is mainly to catch you up, but also 'for reasons' in the story. Jacob could tell you about it... but he is out of contact.
Ohh, okay! I thought you meant he'd lost a day somewhere along the way earlier in the timeline but I understand now. I deliberately did not say what Benji was currently doing in my post because I wasn't sure about the timing. Benji would still be in his apartment then? Or is this the sort of lost time where he's been continuing to do stuff but just doesn't remember it? Miriam was supposed to visit 'yesterday' afternoon -- does he remember that?
Mar 12, 2025 11:51 am
oopsylon says:
... I thought you meant he'd lost a day somewhere along the way earlier in the timeline ...
I was trying to be mysterious... that is most often a bad idea. 'Place clarity over creative expression', I always say... and then I do this. :D
oopsylon says:
... Benji would still be in his apartment then? ...
Yes. Dealing with the rats, just where we last saw you.
oopsylon says:
... he's been continuing to do stuff but just doesn't remember it? ...
No.
oopsylon says:
... Miriam was supposed to visit 'yesterday' afternoon ...
She came, you were not there. Lizabeth was worried and sought council from Joe who confirms you went into Jacob's shop with another man and did not come out... till this morning. So Teddy has lost a day too.

Sorry for the confusion. Ask any follow up questions you need. The characters will learn this later.
Mar 12, 2025 11:57 am
oopsylon says:
(in RP) ...
Hello Emma!
I’m here! I’m afraid you will need to invite me inside :(
Yours, Benji
Can Emma invite Benji in? Or does it have to be someone who actually lives there? And then, does Chablis count, as she is not human anymore?

Chablis could easily come to the door to invite Benji in, in this case. I am not sure about the mythology of a vampire resident inviting another vampire in, but it is her home? Seems to overly complicate the scene if Chablis can't issue the invite, but we can work around that if we want to.

Was Bejni stopped at the door the the building?! Does he need another invite for the flat? Does one resident of a block of flats (apparent building) giving an invite mean all the residents are vulnerable? (If David invites a vampire in, Emma is still vulnerable, even in her bedroom.): Or are flats a particularity good protection since they provide two barriers? Is that why communal living became popular?

I assumed it was the door to the flat when I framed Gene not going in (also, 'not breaking in', which was his reasoning:) as a red-herring that he might be the vamp. :)
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