The Tavern (OOC Discussion Thread):

Happy to continue. :)

Genisisect and Somebox, just waiting for you to post. To the group with the guards, I have been waiting for this for quite some time :)

So have we!

In the story of me somebox and the publican I’m pretty sure somebox was the last one to post...

Feel free to post if you want mate! Otherwise Somebox?

I guess the point I was making is... we are kinda of waiting for the publican to respond to some boxes last post.

This might be a good time to ask if we could impose some sort of structure or general guidelines surrounding the progress of this game. It appears that Whistler is often waiting to make sure everyone has had a chance to post before he posts again, but usually, everyone already has posted at least once and is waiting for more to happen for us to respond to. The big problem is that almost nothing is happening in the DM posts to spark much roleplay, much less plot movement. I've been trying to come up with stuff for Elendin to do that isn't suicidal at level one, and it's been a real struggle.

Now, I do understand how difficult it is to post frequently when life issues get in the way, so I'm not calling on Whistler to post a lot more, just that he be more strategic in what each post accomplishes, so that we players have something to work with. For example, this last post leaves us in a courtroom with a cloaked woman. There is nothing much we can do with that. Nobody has introduced her to us, she hasn't said anything. All that's left for us to do is to ask who she is and why we're being detained, or plead our case (from total ignorance of the situation), or just wait. And the way I've set up Elendin's psychology from the very beginning, the most in-character reaction for her would be to let her rage take over as her fear overcomes her. Of course, I know as a player that would be suicide for the character, so I'm looking for any and every excuse not to do that, but I honestly don't think I should be put in that position by the situation.

It's been well over a month since we started this game and we're still in the middle of the first encounter. If our posting cycle is going to be several days long, then maybe the DM posts could be a little meatier?

Of course, it could be just me who feels this way, in which case, feel free to disagree. :)

Perhaps it's partially our fault for splitting up the party three ways but then there never was a party to begin with. Just a bunch of individuals trying to put out a fire. Of course, it's pretty difficult to bring a bunch of individuals together in the midst of what amount to a melee. On the other hand, I've been in a lot of games that start at an Inn where the game bogs down with parlay and chitchat and it takes a month of real time just to get out of the Inn. Now, if something had happened at the fire that may have drawn us together in the first place, it might have been different. Perhaps we were all celebrating a wedding of a mutual friend even though none of us knew each other or a celebration of a local hero who each one of us individually had some relationship to. But somebody getting arrested who none of us knew is apparently not sufficient to draw all of us together.

I agree, allowing a group of unconnected characters to go three separate ways hasn't helped. Still, it could have worked if each group had something to actually do instead of react to tiny incremental plot elements.

It's valid feedback, the games I have run in the past tend to be much more player driven. I basically lay out the elements and have an overarching story idea in mind then leave the rest up to the players to interact with the world and ensure that it reacts in a way that would be consistent with the characters in it. The main driving point of the chapter was going to begin after you had all rested and it would have also been something that could have reunited the group but I can move that up if you would prefer?

I think the problem here is that there wasn't enough of a foundation for a player-driven game, and the captain and his guards were just WAY too powerful for a first-level encounter. There appeared to be a lot of signaling that we'd end up dead if we resisted, so we went along, expecting something to happen rather quickly. And we stayed in that limbo for four weeks.

As I have said, I am happier to make "meatier" posts if that is what everyone would prefer. The danger with that though is that scenes may move on without everyone having a chance to act, if everyone is okay with that, then that is what I will do.

But it seems to be that everyone posts what tiny bit makes sense to post, and then your responses take days to come. We wait and wait for the next thing, having already played out what little RP we can dream up, and it appears that you are still waiting for something even though every player has posted.

I realize that I sound like a bitch, and I really don't mean it that way. But this game is pretty frustrating and seems to be going nowhere.

Okay, you have made your point and I have said how I intend to address your feedback depending on how the rest of the group feels about it. I have also indicated that the main plot thread for the chapter hasn't been revealed yet, since it is dependent on you resting but based on your feedback I will move it up. Can I ask how everyone else feels about this? Would you prefer I make larger posts even if that means you miss a chance to post in a scene?

From both the player and the DM side, working out how much action to include in each post is a really tricky balancing act. Too little, and things drag - too much, and you end up trampling over the other players, or railroading inadvertently. As a new group, we're going to take a little while to hit our stride as far as pacing, but I think it's a good idea to talk about it. Thanks for bringing up the discussion, Moonbeam.

Player-driven action tends to work best when the players have a good, clear image of the setting, their place in it, and a sense of what they want to accomplish. I think at the moment we're still "exploring" this setting and trying to answer some of those questions, and sometimes were can get tangled in differences of opinion - Moonbeam/Elendin has picked up a much darker, scarier vibe from the police than I/Margaret have, for instance, and the question of who is "right" has major implications for the setting and the story... so in that situation, we're waiting for Whistler to drive some action that "settles" the question. As we establish more about the nature of the world, the game will naturally become more player-driven, as our characters gain agency and power.

Whistler, from playing in my game you can probably guess that I'm in favour of longer DM posts. ;)

Very good points, kadeton. I'm going to amend my stance a bit on the captain and guards to say that, rather than overt signaling that they are too powerful for our characters to take on, that there was a degree of insistence in the RP that I interpreted - perhaps incorrectly - as said signaling. I do stipulate, though, that we had at least two characters repeatedly stating they were surrendering and it felt like the captain wouldn't take yes for an answer! :D

I will fully admit based on some negative experiences in my past games, I am perhaps overcorrecting in the wrong direction. We'll keep dialling it and see how we go.

I actually really like the way that played out; between Margaret's "The police have to act according to the law, they can't touch us" attitude, Elendin's "The police are just armed thugs, you can't trust them" fears, and Wynn's "Everything happens according to a divine plan" confidence, we had some great character interaction going on, and each of us was justified in our views even though we don't agree.

It sounds like it's all about to go bad, but that's a good formative event. If Margaret's belief that the police exist to serve the law is broken, then that will become a major focus in her quest to fix the world. It will reinforce El's lack of trust, and perhaps alter Wynn's rose-tinted view of things as well.

Oh, for sure, it's poised to make things really interesting. My objection was not to how things were shaking out but more to the glacial nature of the shaking. :)

Was the last post an improvement?