The Grand Tournament Of Leander (5E)

Just wondering if there will be any interest in a story which starts of during a grand tournament, the tl;dr is champions from around the world have been invited to a grand tournament in a secluded island of Leander which was once a country like North Korea and very hostile to outsiders due to multiple wars over the years, the inhabitants are lionkin, it will be the first time the country has opened its doors to the outside world due to the leaders father dying and the now leader being more progressive to the outside world, more lore and who they fought, etc will be in game

Since the flood gates are open, every race is open even homebrews, any type of character is allowed except the chaotic evils and that type, evil is allowed but a more cooperative evil lol anyway; why you're there? A simple merchant selling his wares, a entertainer hired to entertain the crowds, a champion fighting for his lands, a royal embassador from a far away place visiting for the tournament, a simple pickpocket using his skills to steal money from the masses, anything you can think of you can be, you don't have to be a world class hero or you're typical hero either, backgrounds can be used but I feel like they restrict from what you want to be sometimes, those finer details will be discussed later.

classes and also non-classes, you can start with a class or a non-class, the non-class is for those who are just simple folk, not really trained in combat but can learn there class at a later date, it sounds strange I know but take for example a simple stable boy, not trained in combat, can hold a blade and use it but not really a fighter standard, learns it over time and becomes a fighter learning all the perks as he goes (where you will join up with you're class is determined on you're effectiveness, wizards and such obviously a little harder to balance but I'll find a way) the non-class will get an feat (cannot have two feats if race grants a added feat), you'll obviously pick a class before hand which you want to go into, some stuff will be open where some others won't

If you're a champion you'll be entered into the tournament (cannot die in it FYI), everyone else can spectate unless working, guards, merchants, pickpockets, etc can be working or spectating either choice

This may be a long one off but it might not be, it will not be a one a day post either, I will be writing heavily for this as in long story posts in massive detail, creating multiple NPCs, too many I feel lol but anyway all and any are welcome, if you want a simple character that's fine, if you want something out of left field that is fine, be whoever you want to be, create any backstory you want, you want a polar bearkin champion, go ahead, you want a goblin Royal fine by me or a simple halfling criminal rouge be my guest, everyone is welcome on the island of Leander

Any and all questions or concerns can be brought up, fire away if you have any

Note: if keen interest it'll be some time before it goes up, want to work over the finer details and such, characters can change the game so adaptions will have to be made, concerning me as a DM this will be my first time properly, I have a campaign with a friend here but I love writing, I love the interactions with characters, what people can bring to you're story etc

This sounds like fun. I'd be interested, my question is, are you following gods and lore of the regular worlds (greyhawk, dragonlance, ravenloft, etc.) or your own. I already have an idea for a character, but would need deity information. Thanks and I am looking forward to playing!

I would absolutely be interested in this, but if there's enough interest, I would defer taking a spot in favor of someone who isn't already in a bunch of games.

sounds fun. count me in in the same way as spaceseeker

Oh man, this sounds like a ton of fun! Please put me on the same list as Spaceseeker and Candi. The usual suspects, LOL! :-D

Spaceseeker, I understand but if there's enough interest I may open it up to more than just the usual four players cause it's going to be slow going, I don't want people who want to join feel like there going to be taking up a spot instead of a newer person, if there's like 8 people then so be it, any and all are welcome to join, no matter if you have twenty games going or one
Regular but with different types of races I'm open to new Gods or deities, if you want to make a new one up for a type of human, elf, dwarf, whatever not from the normal cookie cutter style then go for it if it doesn't fit truly you're character, it's just a be who you wanna be campaign, pray who you want to pray too... within reason tho lol

If your ok with beta stuff, I'd love to try a psionic warrior using the mystic. I have s half built Goliath psion I could use, but on the other hand the *idea* of starting as a peasant or beggar and having powers manifest, then learning and struggling to control them also sounds really intriguing to me.

Yeah me too, I'm drawn to the idea of a non-classed character (at least initially). But yeah the mystic is awesome! I play one in one of Biscuitfiend's games.

There's a pdf by Wizards about it so yeah it should all be good and yeah if you want to start as a beggar or whatever that isn't really trained so to speak, merchant who was addicted to unique Unknown potions which manifested into those powers, can even be a champion who tried gaining the upper hand with potions etc, how you get the powers is endless and how you deal and struggle with them too, just don't go blowing up the world lol

How you get the powers/abilities is totally by how well you roll the dice, if you want to be a rogue and fail a lot of stealth checks or miss a lot of rolls you won't be learning as quicker than say someone who rolls constantly high if you know what I mean lol

Great. I'll think on it a bit, this will be fun! I love the idea of starting as less than a heroic character and growing into it. That's really novel for a 5e game.

As a game designer this worries me a bit. It's never fun to not get to do something, and more importantly not to advance, just because you are unlucky. The best systems, to my mind, that use check results as a mode of growth require players to both succeed and fail to grow, or simp,y to fail (I think that's the very best. Because then, if you succeed st the check you get a positive outcome. If you fail, yiu learn something and make progress towards becoming better. Thus, success and failure are positive, but differently so). But, I'll trust yah.

How exactly, if you know exactly, were you planning to handle the non-class characters? Slowly gaining the aspects of your class until you are level 1 I presume, but on what conditions do you gain a new feature / aspect? How do you build a classless character (i expect your hit dice would be based on your declared class)?

I've never liked the idea of just being this hero from the get go, I feel like you have to make up a lot of the backstory where as you're backstory is happening and you're becoming this hero then you're a hero get on with it, if that hero dies early it's not going to really effect you where as if you get that person up to a point where it is a hero then it's gonna suck if you lose it

If you fail constantly you will get that ability but further down the line than others but follow along the class path, I did the example as rouge, if there's two rogues, one passes say three stealth rolls and the other fails three, that person has shown there learnt how to be proficient in sneaking giving them the option of a sneak attack, the clumsy rogue who failed isn't proficient in that art yet, same goes for say a beginner wizard, he knows a few spells to start, if he misses a spell or it fails he's not technically progressing, take real world for example, if I want to be good at something I have to work at it till I'm good enough but when you're on that track of a class you're on it

Example; rogue to level 1 - 10 points
Stealth check pass: 2 point
Stealth check fail: 1 point

It means that you still get points even if you fail, someone constantly failing will be a rogue but will take more time becoming one, think of it as being gifted, learning something new isn't easy, conjuring up a fireball and throwing it takes a bit of skill, you still learn if you fail, I need to do this with me hands, throwing it I need to position myself this way, some may just be like I'm a king of the fireballs and others may be how do I do this again

Everything is class based, if you want a wizard roll to benefit you as a wizard, you won't get the tools of you're specific class until you become that class too apart from stuff you'd already have ie a spell book if you're a wizard etc, you'll have to buy them (but they'll be technically free because it just won't come from you're gold pieces)

The zero-level game has always been a fun way to start a campaign. For D&D5, I'd probably just roll up the ability scores, determine a race, and then choose the character's background details. I'd be up to having the adventure itself determine the class path, as in the classic old zero-level modules. Does that work for you, or do you need us to choose a class that we're working towards?

You can start that way if you want to and decide down the line what class you want to be, I don't know how you will become a class tho and where you will fall as a true non-class tho

Here are two arguments for switching it up and making failures 2 points and successes 1 point:

1) You're thinking of skill checks as tests not learning experiences. In a test success demonstrates that you have a capacity. While in a learning experience, what you learn depends on how the experience went and how you reflect on it. You learn more from failing (and reflecting on why you failed) than from succeeded (and reflecting on why you succeed). If your aim is to represent learning, failure should be 2 points, and success 1 point. Reaching 10 points represents having obtained a capacity or proficiency. At that point you could now pass a test (which is why you now have the new ability which makes it easier for you going forward).

2) From a player psychology perspective, using this kind of advancement system gives you a unique opportunity to make failures feel less awful. Normally in D&D 5e, failing a check or attack roll is the worst possible outcome. The result is either you achieve nothing (or, on a skill check, probably you have lost progress). If advancement is more heavily weighed on failures, then failures (paradoxically) become exciting (but in a different way from successes).

My expectation would be that, as someone who isn't starting as an adventurer, I would find a circumstance (monsters escaping, enemy attack, needing to retrieve a stolen item, needing to find a cure, etc) that would drive me to adventure in the role playing. In trying to deal with those issues, I would come into contact with NPCs who would inspire me with their abilities, and early in the game I would choose one to emulate...and that would be my class choice. Alternatively, an NPC could observe my character attempting something and could approach me with tips...a bit like the way factions work in all the official D&D5 adventure material, except that instead of a representative of the Harper's approaching, it would be a representative of the Holy Warriors Of Selune (representing paladins), for example.

I realize that this approach is complicated for certain classes like a warlock, because it wouldn't be a person that approaches the PC, it would be some sort of access to a dread pact that would present itself: finding a Dread Ring, reading a book of forbidden lore, accidentally dropping into a ritual, that sort of thing. Or maybe in your world, warlocks do recruit fresh blood for their masters!

Just to piggy-back here: I both agree with Candi (I make a system of learning from failure available in Skyrealms of Jorune) and at the same time feel cautious because it feels like this is the tip of a much larger iceberg in D&D5...

Really my one complaint about how D&D5 works: there is no way for PCs to increase skills or learn new ones in the unmodified game. If you choose to allow the optional feats rule, then a player can choose to take the new skills feat every four levels, but that's the only way to learn new abilities (and that's somewhat broken - I'm either proficient in a skill or unskilled; there's no way for me to be moderately better at a skill). The points system you have described (or the variant Candi suggests) feels like it could be expanded as a way to address that. Certainly as a player, I'd want to continue to unlock class abilities through succeeding/failing to use those abilities (ie, practice) even after I got to level 1. But it then begs the question: why couldn't you learn skills not related to your class in the same way?

I love this idea. I'm not experienced in 5th but I would learn.