[OOC] Game/Rules Talk and Discussions

load previous
Sep 10, 2024 6:08 pm
Shadowknight says:
A slight mechanical note regarding combat rolls.

In ACKS, rules as written, combat is generally mechanically inferred as Roll a number or higher to succeed, the Armor Class of the creature is added to the number.

I, personally, am not a fan of this as it is a little confusing for me. So, in my head, I translate it to a system more like D&D 3.0/3.5; I add 10 to the creature's AC and add a number to the d20 die roll equal to your combat modifier (Which is + (10-whatever number it says you need to roll))

This does not change the number you actually need to roll to hit.

I personally feel like my method is a bit more streamlined, but you are free to see it either way as the mechanics of the roll are the same.

This does not actually change the way the game is played at all, but I did want to let people know I was doing it that way in my head just in case other people wanted to do the same thing, and for transparency.

An Example: In rules as written, a person with 9+ to hit is fighting a goblin with AC 1. The 1 is added to the 9+, meaning that the player has to roll a 10+ to hit. In my method, the person has +1 to hit and is fighting a goblin with AC 11, meaning that the player has to roll a 10+ to hit.

I don't think I've ever come across a scenario where my method is not the same (mechanically) as the original rules, but if anyone wants to put their opinion in, please feel free. Or if you have some other scenario where there is a difference.
Mathematician/statistician in RL, here. The two methods are algebraically equivalent.

Read ":=" as "defined to equal"

Let AT := Attack Throw
Let AC := Armor Class
Let x := d20 roll.

Standard method: Success := x >= AC + AT

You define "Combat Modifier" (CM) as 10 - AT. So you have at first:
Success := x + CM >= AC + 10
Expand CM into its definition
= x + 10 - AT >= AC + 10
Subtract 10 from both sides and add AT to both sides:
= x >= AC + AT

QED
Last edited September 10, 2024 6:09 pm
Sep 10, 2024 6:18 pm
Okay, the faiths and philosophies that would be known to your characters (as natives of the Duchy of Averancia) are up in the world building forum. These are the "European" and Elven-based philosophies. There are other cultures besides the "European" one, but for the most part you haven't interacted with any of them.

I know there's an "Oriental" culture and an "Arabic" culture that will have slightly different belief systems, but those would be very alien to most people familiar with the "European" culture. Oh, and the Thrassians. They are a little bit alien to the "Europeans" also.
Sep 10, 2024 6:18 pm
Avraham says:
Shadowknight says:
A slight mechanical note regarding combat rolls.



In ACKS, rules as written, combat is generally mechanically inferred as Roll a number or higher to succeed, the Armor Class of the creature is added to the number.

I, personally, am not a fan of this as it is a little confusing for me. So, in my head, I translate it to a system more like D&D 3.0/3.5; I add 10 to the creature's AC and add a number to the d20 die roll equal to your combat modifier (Which is + (10-whatever number it says you need to roll))

This does not change the number you actually need to roll to hit.

I personally feel like my method is a bit more streamlined, but you are free to see it either way as the mechanics of the roll are the same.

This does not actually change the way the game is played at all, but I did want to let people know I was doing it that way in my head just in case other people wanted to do the same thing, and for transparency.

An Example: In rules as written, a person with 9+ to hit is fighting a goblin with AC 1. The 1 is added to the 9+, meaning that the player has to roll a 10+ to hit. In my method, the person has +1 to hit and is fighting a goblin with AC 11, meaning that the player has to roll a 10+ to hit.

I don't think I've ever come across a scenario where my method is not the same (mechanically) as the original rules, but if anyone wants to put their opinion in, please feel free. Or if you have some other scenario where there is a difference.
Mathematician/statistician in RL, here. The two methods are algebraically equivalent.

Read ":=" as "defined to equal"

Let AT := Attack Throw
Let AC := Armor Class
Let x := d20 roll.

Standard method: Success := x >= AC + AT

You define "Combat Modifier" (CM) as 10 - AT. So you have at first:
Success := x + CM >= AC + 10
Expand CM into its definition
= x + 10 - AT >= AC + 10
Subtract 10 from both sides and add AT to both sides:
= x >= AC + AT

QED
I love it
Last edited September 10, 2024 6:19 pm
Sep 10, 2024 6:40 pm
Shadowknight says:
Okay, the faiths and philosophies that would be known to your characters (as natives of the Duchy of Averancia) are up in the world building forum. These are the "European" and Elven-based philosophies. There are other cultures besides the "European" one, but for the most part you haven't interacted with any of them.

I know there's an "Oriental" culture and an "Arabic" culture that will have slightly different belief systems, but those would be very alien to most people familiar with the "European" culture. Oh, and the Thrassians. They are a little bit alien to the "Europeans" also.
Let me clarify this a little. Most of the faiths and philosophies that have been posted your Character will be somewhat familiar with (they will probably not know all of the tenets and such unless it is a faith/philosophy they adhere to), but the information here is what you players need to know to roleplay what your character knows. (I hope that makes sense.)
Sep 10, 2024 7:37 pm
@Shadowknight, if it is OK with you, when I post in cabin font, that is an indication that I am trying to whisper, or at least taking deliberate steps so as not be heard/noticed outside my immediate are.
Sep 10, 2024 7:45 pm
Avraham says:
@Shadowknight, if it is OK with you, when I post in cabin font, that is an indication that I am trying to whisper, or at least taking deliberate steps so as not be heard/noticed outside my immediate are.
Sure. That works.
Sep 11, 2024 1:21 am
Avraham says:
@Shadowknight, if it is OK with you, when I post in cabin font, that is an indication that I am trying to whisper, or at least taking deliberate steps so as not be heard/noticed outside my immediate are.
when you post in cabin fontyou should make it small. Large feels like you are yelling.
Sep 11, 2024 1:28 am
Constablebrew says:
Avraham says:
@Shadowknight, if it is OK with you, when I post in cabin font, that is an indication that I am trying to whisper, or at least taking deliberate steps so as not be heard/noticed outside my immediate are.
when you post in cabin fontyou should make it small. Large feels like you are yelling.
:D Any different font would do. I picked cabin because it isn't fully "filled in"—it's about half whitespace. I make it large because it's harder to read at normal size.

So it is madness, yes, but with a soupçon of method.
Last edited September 11, 2024 1:29 am
Sep 11, 2024 1:49 am
When Rafn posts in this font, something is about to die
Sep 11, 2024 2:01 am
Jomsviking says:
When Rafn posts in this font, something is about to die
Then I hope our foes see that often.
Sep 11, 2024 9:50 am
Guys, I'd like some thoughts/feedback on what you may think would be the most interesting story. I struggled when deciding on which spells and proficiencies to take. I have two characters in mind and can't pick.

In one version, I wanted to min/max the WIS + Performance + Crafting to make ceremonial trinkets with as little risk as possible. That version of Wilfrid would go hard into the black magic Death and Summoning. He would be a skilled singer and calligraphy artist. His fingers and robes would perpetually be stained with inky black smudges from his constant writing. With him, he would carry a case full of sheets of vellum. Many of these are penned with beautiful copies of poems or stories that he sells or gives as gifts. Others are his secret ceremonial trinkets, stored spells to be cast. He would secretly cast something like Choking Grasp or Cause Light Wounds, while also casting Cure Light Wounds regularly. In part because he enjoys the sense of superior benevolence it gives him, and in part to avoid suspicion of the other, dark magic he knows.

In the other version, I wanted a his worst stats as his prime requisites. While he is no fool or idiot, his ego inflates his sense of self. He uses his magic to gain influence (Mystic Aura) and Seduction. He would cast Charm Person and Ensorcellement. He revels in having power over others and being one of the important people in the room.

Both of these character archetypes are cool. But I also have a vision of Wilfrid casting Conjure Cacodemon Spawn. He would love having power over these otherworldly demons. He would believe that summoning these creatures and controlling them is acting on Elion's tenants, bringing these dark creatures under the power of the light. Of course he would know that revealing such a black magic would get him arrested or killed, but that's because those peasants and unenlightened are too idiotic to understand that he is serving Elion, truly. While I love this dark secret, I'm not sure how this would fit in the game world. Choking someone out could be hard to pin on him as black magic. But having demons under his control for a day at a time is a giant red flag.

Wilfrid Aelwynd: https://gamersplane.com/characters/custom/30513/
Sep 12, 2024 5:20 am
@Constablebrew My thoughts are that it seems as all three characters are leaning heavily into the possibility of chaos and corruption. Even your second option is going to amass corruption when casting charm person as its duration is greater than an hour. @Shadowknight (SK) is only allowing Lawful and Neutral characters, and I don't see how any of your choices will survive more than a few encounters without an alignment shift or a slew of disfigurations, if SK allows that option. Ceremonialists still gain corruption from black magic (page 114), perhaps a little more slowly than eldritch casters, but inevitable. For the purposes of this campaign, it may be wiser to stick to the white and acceptable grey.
Sep 12, 2024 6:21 am
I dont know what is chaotic about an apex predator eating anything.

I think it comes down to modern humanity. Absolute goodness is absolute evil. You cannot dictate absolute morality because morality is subjective. Only objective truths may be absolutes.

Mankind "rebels" into slavery. Or is it that the slavers, dogmatists, demonize that which is beyond their understanding? Or perhaps the very notion of good and evil was accurately described by the ancients and it doesn't matter ultimately because we humans are simply food for Set.

Good and evil, are this or that.

That said, I am firmly neutral. Whatever the rules say are rules are the rules.
Sep 12, 2024 6:58 am
Avraham says:
@Constablebrew My thoughts are that it seems as all three characters are leaning heavily into the possibility of chaos and corruption. Even your second option is going to amass corruption when casting charm person as its duration is greater than an hour. @Shadowknight (SK) is only allowing Lawful and Neutral characters, and I don't see how any of your choices will survive more than a few encounters without an alignment shift or a slew of disfigurations, if SK allows that option. Ceremonialists still gain corruption from black magic (page 114), perhaps a little more slowly than eldritch casters, but inevitable. For the purposes of this campaign, it may be wiser to stick to the white and acceptable grey.
My recommendation is to start with grey or white magic, even if you feel drawn to use black magic, I wouldn't use it right out of the gate. Let that part build up in the story to a suitable climax, where it feels like a life or death situation or something equally dramatic. And then as your character gets used to the corruption and the mutations it becomes easier and easier to use black magic. At least, that is how I would play it... kind of like an addiction. That being said, keeping such secrets (even from your fellow player characters, potentially) will have a major part in the story. A part that many might find interesting and intriguing. If in doubt, just refer to the forum rules. Avoid interpersonal drama; avoid disruption; aim for shared storytelling and inter-character drama. And remember, this is a gritty campaign; I will let those decisions play out as I think they would for the characters, sometimes with negative repercussions.
Sep 12, 2024 7:09 am
Jomsviking says:
I dont know what is chaotic about an apex predator eating anything.

I think it comes down to modern humanity. Absolute goodness is absolute evil. You cannot dictate absolute morality because morality is subjective. Only objective truths may be absolutes.

Mankind "rebels" into slavery. Or is it that the slavers, dogmatists, demonize that which is beyond their understanding? Or perhaps the very notion of good and evil was accurately described by the ancients and it doesn't matter ultimately because we humans are simply food for Set.

Good and evil, are this or that.

That said, I am firmly neutral. Whatever the rules say are rules are the rules.
@Jomsviking ACKS alignment isn't so much about good vs evil (it is, but not too much), but more so chaos vs order.
[ +- ] Alignment (pg37)
Sep 12, 2024 7:45 am
Shadowknight says:
Avraham says:
@Constablebrew My thoughts are that it seems as all three characters are leaning heavily into the possibility of chaos and corruption. Even your second option is going to amass corruption when casting charm person as its duration is greater than an hour. @Shadowknight (SK) is only allowing Lawful and Neutral characters, and I don't see how any of your choices will survive more than a few encounters without an alignment shift or a slew of disfigurations, if SK allows that option. Ceremonialists still gain corruption from black magic (page 114), perhaps a little more slowly than eldritch casters, but inevitable. For the purposes of this campaign, it may be wiser to stick to the white and acceptable grey.
My recommendation is to start with grey or white magic, even if you feel drawn to use black magic, I wouldn't use it right out of the gate. Let that part build up in the story to a suitable climax, where it feels like a life or death situation or something equally dramatic. And then as your character gets used to the corruption and the mutations it becomes easier and easier to use black magic. At least, that is how I would play it... kind of like an addiction. That being said, keeping such secrets (even from your fellow player characters, potentially) will have a major part in the story. A part that many might find interesting and intriguing. If in doubt, just refer to the forum rules. Avoid interpersonal drama; avoid disruption; aim for shared storytelling and inter-character drama. And remember, this is a gritty campaign; I will let those decisions play out as I think they would for the characters, sometimes with negative repercussions.
@Shadowknight The drug addiction analogy is a great one. We are on the same page

I agree that I should start with a white or gray magic spell, if anything so that he has a game mechanic that can be used regularly and not completely neuter himself. The black magic would definitely be a very closely held secret and very rarely used. He will work hard to avoid using the black magic unless absolutely necessary. In story terms, I'd be looking to use the black magic when it would be an epic tilt and exciting for everyone.

@Avraham the duration of the spells doesn't impact corruption, only the intent of the use. Charm person is explicitly on the black magic list and would always incur corruption. Ensorcellement or possibly Slumber are gray magic and may be used carefully.
[ +- ] Corruption
Avraham says:
For the purposes of this campaign, it may be wiser to stick to the white and acceptable grey.
I don't have to play the occultist - pretty much every other class is available to me. If it's a hard pass for you, let me know and I'll spin up something less disruptive. If you're ok with it tho, I'm prepared to see my character come to an untimely end if that is what it takes to make an amazing and memorable story. If any of those three variations pique your interest more so than the others, let me know. I'm stumped.
Last edited September 12, 2024 7:46 am
Sep 12, 2024 7:56 am
Yeah I have read a *lot* of theology. I myself am a being of order and see the world in terms of harmony and discord myself.

In this game, I am playing The Prophet.

Paradise lies to the west fellow Primals. Will you join my quest for the Sun?
Sep 12, 2024 3:24 pm
Okay, we should have all characters up now. Do you all want to start the official campaign on Friday, or Monday. If you're thinking about going with a different class, Constablebrew, we might want to wait until Monday. You can get the same feeling for the type of character you are talking about by playing a Loremaster or even an Ecclesiastic. Occultists are definitely more of the variety of embracing Chaos instead of resisting it. But I leave it up to you. I could see this character having a huge fall and redemption cycle as an occultist (Hmmm, a novel idea maybe.)
Sep 12, 2024 9:48 pm
Whatever works for the group. @Constablebrew, take the time you need to make a character you would enjoy playing which first inside of @Shadowknight's guildines :)
load next

You do not have permission to post in this thread.