Apr 28, 2017 10:06 pm
Have you guys seen the skill feats Unearthed Arcana?
What do you guys think? Would you allow these J?
What do you guys think? Would you allow these J?
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Apr 30, 2017 7:32 am
There's been some discussion about that article here.
Apr 30, 2017 7:40 am
I was finally able to post to the game a few minutes ago. I must admit it wasn't easy catching up, given the amount of exposition that has unfolded. As well, sometimes what gets in the way of posting is the desire to write a well-crafted post, which is of course not always possible.
I didn't have this planned for Ivor but the idea just came to me and I thought that it might make things interesting, as well as explain Ivor's recent silence: he is deeply superstitious, and this mission has him spooked. He certainly feels out of his depth, which is ironic given that he s Dannein and should be the most comfortable here. I'll reveal more details of his backstory as inspiration allows, but the general idea is that the community where he grew up was steeped in superstition and magic. I did already mention in my very first story post that "There's no one waiting for the son of Conall back there. Everyone he ever cared about is long gone. That's why he boarded the reaver longboat Fuath in the first place..." What happened there? Somethiing supernatural, maybe? We'll see. I'm pretty excited by this new direction for Ivor. Suggestions are very welcome! :-)
I didn't have this planned for Ivor but the idea just came to me and I thought that it might make things interesting, as well as explain Ivor's recent silence: he is deeply superstitious, and this mission has him spooked. He certainly feels out of his depth, which is ironic given that he s Dannein and should be the most comfortable here. I'll reveal more details of his backstory as inspiration allows, but the general idea is that the community where he grew up was steeped in superstition and magic. I did already mention in my very first story post that "There's no one waiting for the son of Conall back there. Everyone he ever cared about is long gone. That's why he boarded the reaver longboat Fuath in the first place..." What happened there? Somethiing supernatural, maybe? We'll see. I'm pretty excited by this new direction for Ivor. Suggestions are very welcome! :-)
Last edited April 30, 2017 10:19 am
Apr 30, 2017 10:25 am
On UA Feat Skills, I just got a chance to read these this morning. These are really cool ideas - definitely a way to push a character towards a certain style or specialty. Also, great options to boost performance on targeted actions without the use of magic in most cases - so I am a fan of that. I think most of these will fit in our game no problem.
Must admit there are a few that I would want to think over a little more, discuss between us if someone is interested. As you might guess, they are the ones more magical or fantastical in nature (Arcanist, Theologian come to mind), just to work through how they do or don't translate into the setting.
Seems like a few would need some discussion or story line to explain how the skill was learned or gained, but that is true with a lot of Feats so no real problem there.
On Ivor : Again, good to have you back, Jabes. Don't call it a comeback, Ivor's been here for years! I dig the explanations and links to backstory. Ivor seems like a pretty volatile and scary guy with a lot of suppressed and hidden pressure; not sure exactly what will happen, but it feels like he may be about to go full EXPLOSION MODE in a way that won't be good for his opponents.
On that note, everyone has done such a great work on weaving in backstory and providing so much depth to the characters. I can't believe that these guys have only been in a few scenes. They seem like movie characters that I have known for a long time already.
Must admit there are a few that I would want to think over a little more, discuss between us if someone is interested. As you might guess, they are the ones more magical or fantastical in nature (Arcanist, Theologian come to mind), just to work through how they do or don't translate into the setting.
Seems like a few would need some discussion or story line to explain how the skill was learned or gained, but that is true with a lot of Feats so no real problem there.
On Ivor : Again, good to have you back, Jabes. Don't call it a comeback, Ivor's been here for years! I dig the explanations and links to backstory. Ivor seems like a pretty volatile and scary guy with a lot of suppressed and hidden pressure; not sure exactly what will happen, but it feels like he may be about to go full EXPLOSION MODE in a way that won't be good for his opponents.
On that note, everyone has done such a great work on weaving in backstory and providing so much depth to the characters. I can't believe that these guys have only been in a few scenes. They seem like movie characters that I have known for a long time already.
Apr 30, 2017 12:55 pm
My opinion:
I really like the options to add skills and expertise with these feats. A lot. It's nice add giving the ability to pick up a +1 to an attribute and another skill (or expertise). I think removing the requirement to take Rogue or Knowledge Cleric just for Expertise is an awesome idea. And, in hindsight, it's so brilliantly basic that I'm surprised it didn't make it into the 5e when they first published it. It just seems so obvious now.
However, I think they easily could have stopped at the +1 & added skill/expertise (which immediately has a value as good, or better, than +2 to an attribute). It's the Expertise that's the real payday there, and well worth the feat when coupled with the +1 attribute. Remember, many players would dip into Rogue just for that Expertise alone, mechanically eliminating a Level 20 ability to do so, because Expertise is that good.
As far as the UA Feats, if it looks like magic, sounds like magic, plays like magic, imitates magic... just dump it.
The reason I'm playing Dark Thrones is because of the almost non-existent level of magic. Hell, I'm thrilled that the group is a bunch of warrior types. Personally, I tend to make wizard type characters and the like; more complex to play, more options and ways to go about doing things. However, I've gotten to the point where (to me) it just seems ridiculous what spellcasters can do, and so I'm off that train and standard issue D&D. Ultimately, as everyone knows, the most invaluable characters are the spellcasters at higher levels; non-magic types are kind of just there, waiting for a melee for the most part because it's the spellcasters that solve everything with their massive repertoire of arcane/divine tools.
If you look at the Your text to link here... it's easy to see that there isn't a non-spellcaster that can hold a candle to any of it. Sure, it might be fun to play a non-caster, but when it comes down to it for traditional D&D, magic is your problem solver and award winner. I have seen non-spellcasters patiently watching from the sidelines, both as a player, and DM. It starts around 5th level.
As we've played, what I'm enjoying the most, as part of the setting, is the complete lack of spellcasting and special effects type abilities (a la the Ranger, Totem Barbarians, Monks, etc). It is absolutely refreshing that the party gets on without any of that, and I also think it adds tremendous mystery to the game, which is the big draw. Regular badass guys with hardware and guts going up against the unknown. I wouldn't have it any other way.
I think even adding minor effects that play like magic will take away from the Dark Thrones setting. Although some could be played off as a character's near mystical sense or feeling (like detect magic from Arcanist) it will still be introducing magic type effects into our game, which will spoil what I think is the best part of Dark Thrones: the mystery. The inability to just use 'magic ability X' and find out 'Y'. Even in our subconscious we'll all know that some iteration of magic is in the game.
From Theologian, even abilities like Detect Evil and Detect Good, again, even portrayed as a character's sense, will still play like magic. And, to me it would simply spoil some of those moments where evil character 'X' posing as a good guy just got revealed by what is simply magic, although we're giving it a different name.
Naturalist... druidcraft/detect poison/detect disease: I think the game has more appeal if someone makes a Medicine check (instead of Detect whatever), or a Survivalist check to predict the weather (instead of druidcraft) where varying degrees of success determine the accuracy of the check, rather than "this is what the weather will be, because you used a spell-like ability."
Survivalist... That alarm spell, even portrayed as a character who is a light sleeper... still, it comes off like magic. That first night we were camping in this game, even though it was uneventful, the group took how to handle the night as an important discussion (fire/no fire, both sides with plenty of merit). The alarm spell from Survivalist will just take some of the edge off, and the edge is what makes the game good.
It's the grittiness of Dark Thrones that has appeal to me, and I think spell type abilities will just dilute the flavor. Usually I like more options, but in this case I have to say that less is more.
I really like the options to add skills and expertise with these feats. A lot. It's nice add giving the ability to pick up a +1 to an attribute and another skill (or expertise). I think removing the requirement to take Rogue or Knowledge Cleric just for Expertise is an awesome idea. And, in hindsight, it's so brilliantly basic that I'm surprised it didn't make it into the 5e when they first published it. It just seems so obvious now.
However, I think they easily could have stopped at the +1 & added skill/expertise (which immediately has a value as good, or better, than +2 to an attribute). It's the Expertise that's the real payday there, and well worth the feat when coupled with the +1 attribute. Remember, many players would dip into Rogue just for that Expertise alone, mechanically eliminating a Level 20 ability to do so, because Expertise is that good.
As far as the UA Feats, if it looks like magic, sounds like magic, plays like magic, imitates magic... just dump it.
The reason I'm playing Dark Thrones is because of the almost non-existent level of magic. Hell, I'm thrilled that the group is a bunch of warrior types. Personally, I tend to make wizard type characters and the like; more complex to play, more options and ways to go about doing things. However, I've gotten to the point where (to me) it just seems ridiculous what spellcasters can do, and so I'm off that train and standard issue D&D. Ultimately, as everyone knows, the most invaluable characters are the spellcasters at higher levels; non-magic types are kind of just there, waiting for a melee for the most part because it's the spellcasters that solve everything with their massive repertoire of arcane/divine tools.
If you look at the Your text to link here... it's easy to see that there isn't a non-spellcaster that can hold a candle to any of it. Sure, it might be fun to play a non-caster, but when it comes down to it for traditional D&D, magic is your problem solver and award winner. I have seen non-spellcasters patiently watching from the sidelines, both as a player, and DM. It starts around 5th level.
As we've played, what I'm enjoying the most, as part of the setting, is the complete lack of spellcasting and special effects type abilities (a la the Ranger, Totem Barbarians, Monks, etc). It is absolutely refreshing that the party gets on without any of that, and I also think it adds tremendous mystery to the game, which is the big draw. Regular badass guys with hardware and guts going up against the unknown. I wouldn't have it any other way.
I think even adding minor effects that play like magic will take away from the Dark Thrones setting. Although some could be played off as a character's near mystical sense or feeling (like detect magic from Arcanist) it will still be introducing magic type effects into our game, which will spoil what I think is the best part of Dark Thrones: the mystery. The inability to just use 'magic ability X' and find out 'Y'. Even in our subconscious we'll all know that some iteration of magic is in the game.
From Theologian, even abilities like Detect Evil and Detect Good, again, even portrayed as a character's sense, will still play like magic. And, to me it would simply spoil some of those moments where evil character 'X' posing as a good guy just got revealed by what is simply magic, although we're giving it a different name.
Naturalist... druidcraft/detect poison/detect disease: I think the game has more appeal if someone makes a Medicine check (instead of Detect whatever), or a Survivalist check to predict the weather (instead of druidcraft) where varying degrees of success determine the accuracy of the check, rather than "this is what the weather will be, because you used a spell-like ability."
Survivalist... That alarm spell, even portrayed as a character who is a light sleeper... still, it comes off like magic. That first night we were camping in this game, even though it was uneventful, the group took how to handle the night as an important discussion (fire/no fire, both sides with plenty of merit). The alarm spell from Survivalist will just take some of the edge off, and the edge is what makes the game good.
It's the grittiness of Dark Thrones that has appeal to me, and I think spell type abilities will just dilute the flavor. Usually I like more options, but in this case I have to say that less is more.
Apr 30, 2017 1:43 pm
Yeah. That is generally my line of thinking. The magic effect stuff is probably not going to be permitted, just to maintain the spirit of keeping this specialized modification on setting intact. I just did not want to get into a long write up on each Feat when I'm not even sure which ones people would be interested in specifically anyway.
It can be case-by-case, more discussion as necessary later, but as mentioned the magic and magic-like effects are probably a "no-go" while the more mechanical and natural performance type options are probably an enthusiastic "go."
It can be case-by-case, more discussion as necessary later, but as mentioned the magic and magic-like effects are probably a "no-go" while the more mechanical and natural performance type options are probably an enthusiastic "go."
Apr 30, 2017 2:26 pm
Speaking of Titan...
Apr 30, 2017 2:38 pm
Nice capture there. I find crocodiles, alligators, sharks, killer whales and snakes fascinating. I mean, I don't spend all my time learning about them, but I've just got a sincere appreciation for them and really enjoy those kinds of documentaries.
One of the more interesting tidbits I picked up on a some years ago was how there's a pod of killer whales (fun fact: they are technically dolphins) off of California that hunt great white sharks. The theory is that, at some point, a member of the pod learned that turning sharks upside down causes them to essentially be paralyzed (tonic immobility). Killer whales are extremely intelligent, and it's believed that they started including this lesson in their 'how this pod (family) hunts' training sessions for the young (killer whales around the world have different prey depending on what's available).
Now that pod is known to hunt great whites, and they seem to be mainly interested in eating their livers, IIRC. They pretty much go like a freight train toward the great white, stun it by ramming it, flip it upside down, wait 15 seconds or so for it to go tonic. Serves two.
One of the more interesting tidbits I picked up on a some years ago was how there's a pod of killer whales (fun fact: they are technically dolphins) off of California that hunt great white sharks. The theory is that, at some point, a member of the pod learned that turning sharks upside down causes them to essentially be paralyzed (tonic immobility). Killer whales are extremely intelligent, and it's believed that they started including this lesson in their 'how this pod (family) hunts' training sessions for the young (killer whales around the world have different prey depending on what's available).
Now that pod is known to hunt great whites, and they seem to be mainly interested in eating their livers, IIRC. They pretty much go like a freight train toward the great white, stun it by ramming it, flip it upside down, wait 15 seconds or so for it to go tonic. Serves two.
Apr 30, 2017 10:29 pm
Sharks are pretty much the scariest thing on the planet.
Here is a book that tells the creepy story of a small set of islands off of the coast of California where Great White Sharks conglomerate, for unknown reasons, traveling from 1000s of miles all over the world to swarm around in this little horrifying death zone: Devil's Teeth.
Here is a book that tells the creepy story of a small set of islands off of the coast of California where Great White Sharks conglomerate, for unknown reasons, traveling from 1000s of miles all over the world to swarm around in this little horrifying death zone: Devil's Teeth.
May 1, 2017 12:47 am
I agree that great whites are scarier, as I imagine they are far more inclined to eat people... not many stories of killer whales attacking people (except at Sea World, but that's a whole other documentary called Blackfish, about killer whales in captivity turning into psychopathic killers). And if killer whales did put humans on the menu, man...
One of the cool things about great whites they've learned over the last couple of decades: they migrate all over, swimming up to 5,000 feet deep, and are highly social with a pecking order (waiting turns to dine on floating dead whales, great white orgies). I think it was UCLA in the late 70's/early 80's that had a shark maze to test the intelligence of great whites, with symbol markers, testing memory, etc, finding out they are a lot smarter than previously considered.
And the Farallon Island (Devil's Teeth) from that book you reference J is where those killer whales snack on great whites. Biologists have noticed that the sharks tend to leave the area when the orcas show up (if they know what's good for them). Not sure when the change happened in the area, but the Orcas own the Farallon Isles now (depending on the time of year). There are a few videos showing killer whales eating great whites. This one tells it best.
One of the cool things about great whites they've learned over the last couple of decades: they migrate all over, swimming up to 5,000 feet deep, and are highly social with a pecking order (waiting turns to dine on floating dead whales, great white orgies). I think it was UCLA in the late 70's/early 80's that had a shark maze to test the intelligence of great whites, with symbol markers, testing memory, etc, finding out they are a lot smarter than previously considered.
And the Farallon Island (Devil's Teeth) from that book you reference J is where those killer whales snack on great whites. Biologists have noticed that the sharks tend to leave the area when the orcas show up (if they know what's good for them). Not sure when the change happened in the area, but the Orcas own the Farallon Isles now (depending on the time of year). There are a few videos showing killer whales eating great whites. This one tells it best.
May 1, 2017 1:22 am
Thanks for the link to that book, by the way. Read the excerpt and it definitely got my attention. Not only does it have great whites gathering in numbers, but when I read that people use to live on those islands, the haunted house, the guy who swims the waters anyway for urchins.
Anyway, for $6 with S&H I bought it. Sounds like there are a lot of good stories in that book, and not just about sharks either.
Anyway, for $6 with S&H I bought it. Sounds like there are a lot of good stories in that book, and not just about sharks either.
May 1, 2017 9:44 am
Awesome. I don't think you will be disappointed. Crazy accounts in every direction about that fierce locale. I read that book many years ago, but the scenes and scenarios still come to mind.
Cool videos you linked. I'm pulling for the orca pods to wipe out those sharks too. That sounds like good news to me.
Cool videos you linked. I'm pulling for the orca pods to wipe out those sharks too. That sounds like good news to me.
May 3, 2017 1:40 am
Fellas,
Sorry. Totally pinned down writing a proposal for work. I'll try to get on the boards early AM.
Sorry. Totally pinned down writing a proposal for work. I'll try to get on the boards early AM.
May 4, 2017 11:30 am
What angle to do you guys want to take on Fingol? I'm assuming our characters might of discussed this earlier. Do we want to go the deception route and say we are here to kill Rutcrana to allow him all the prestige?
May 4, 2017 11:42 am
Quote:
Old Island is where Rutcrana has lived for as long as anyone can remember. Mac Ru suspects that rival shaman Fingol has killed Rutcrana and taken over her lair at Old Island, and thereby taken over her magic. Fingol is one of the main collaborators with The Neighbors.May 4, 2017 11:46 am
Yes it could. It's just a thought. There is a rivalry between them and we could play into that.
May 4, 2017 5:16 pm
I went with the direct approach. My thinking is that if there's something Fingol wants out of the political environment that is this swamp, something that he seeks to gain, he'll enlighten us. He may not give a damn about Rutcrana's daughter, or the girl might be important to everyone... who knows. There are a lot of variables here, so leaving it open seemed a good move.
Let's see what he wants. Might come down to an exchange of sorts. If he has a vested interest in protecting the girl or keeping her hidden, well, then we can take other measures.
Let's see what he wants. Might come down to an exchange of sorts. If he has a vested interest in protecting the girl or keeping her hidden, well, then we can take other measures.
May 5, 2017 11:39 am
Oxbox says:
"Are we doing this?"I was looking at it along the lines that Fingol is Rutcrana's replacement, so killing him might piss off the Bat Hannocs much like killing Rutcrana would have (losing one of our bonuses). Of course, it might be the classic situation wherein the Bat Hannocs recognize (at some point) that they were being subjugated against their true will (drugs, magic, whatever), so it won't matter (in that scenario we liberate the Bats and it's all good).
Hell, the smoke could be for an escape, a signal for help, etc. Fingol assumed we were friends of Rutcrana's; Kray's most recent words were aimed at helping Fingol realize we just wanted the girl, period. And, since Fingol made it clear that Rutcrana had many daughters, it seemed very possible that the one we're looking for isn't dead. If she was dead, Kray would pack it up and let Zaituc know; there would be no reason to be in Bat Hannoc territory anymore, since we wouldn't be able to collect on the rest of the contract.
Of course, with the smoke/haze, I've considered that this was likely a fight/conflict from the beginning, and the parlay was just fluff. At the same time I was optimistic (hence the Persuasion roll), willing to allow that Fingol might recognize that we're not threatening him, or allies of Rutcrana. In that case the smoke just rolls away with the breeze, we exchange favors, get our answers, and move on. But, like I said, it might just be one of those times in the game where it's time to fight someone or something.
In the end Kray doesn't have a lot of natural fear anymore, after the Mozamyah jungle tragedy when he was a younger man, so he was pretty comfortable waiting for Fingol to play the violence card first, doing something besides blowing smoke, so to speak.
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