Thunder_Lungz / Grinfletch

Welcome @Thunder_Lungz

This thread is for your character creation. Take a look at welcome and character creation.

If you have any questions you can post them here or if you think they are general on the Q&A

Awesome! Thank you. I’m slowly making my way through the welcome materials. I have a backup of character ideas that I could pull from, but I’ll read the character creation sections first.

The game system is flexible any my setting information are just guidelines. Feel free to think outside the lines and we can work to make it fit the system

Awesome! I’m on the road today (back home from holidays with the fam), but I’ve read through almost all of the setting information. I’ll jump into character creation asap.

Should we make considerations for group cohesion when creating a character?

just do you and have fun with it

As the voice of another player, pick something you want to play. Things change a lot, and players drop in and out, so something that makes sense right now could have changed even before you get done with your introductory adventure. So, make someone you want to play. Whatever group you end up joining will figure out how to deal with it.

Also, as you play, you will gain new Traits, so you character will grow after creation, too.

Alright, thanks for the encouragement. Not sure if I did it correctly, but there’s a character now. Should I go ahead and post in the tiny chat?

What is your minor magic item
Belief is a statement not a patron you serve
When you have that post to the who's who

nice background so I gave you a minor token that ties you to the Fey

Oh cool! Thanks! I’m getting excited! It’s a really well conceived setting.

For now I’ll be happy to hang out with the 3+/week posters, but I imagine I may be able to bump it up to 1/day eventually. I’d like to just figure out how it all works first.

Hey again, I just stumbled onto the roster and I’m happy to do 1 post/day if that’s the only space available. I’ll have more free time this week, so it’s no problem.

Hey there! I have 2 questions:

1. Could it be understood like this as well:

… "marks Grinfletch… as a vassal of a powerful Fey to any fey lord or other servants of that Fey lord…"

OR

…"marks Grinfletch… as a vassal of a powerful Fey to any fey lord or other servants of Grinfletch’s Fey lord…"

Basically, is it recognized by all fey lords and their vassals or by all fey lords and other vassals of his own fey lord. Like, if this sprite is not a servant of Grin’s fey lord, would he still recognize the broach/symbol?

2.
Is his Fey Lord called "the Changeling"? If not, and if you don’t have a fey lord in mind for Grinfletch, I have some preliminary thoughts that might fit. Otherwise, no worries.

B : any powerful fey and other servants of the lord that gave him the broachI can come up with a fey but if you have an idea let me know and add it here or on your character sheet

Perfect! Thank you!

Let me know if this is okay. I also added some info to his character notes.

Looks good

I think I might add quick draw to my character? That with the marksman trait would probably be a good synergy I’m thinking.

Yes that is a good combo 😀

Awesome! I’m not sure where to find the descriptions for the traits, so if you have a minute sometime soon, would you send me the quick shot trait info and I can add it?

Quick Shot: You are able to reload a Ranged Weapon and fire it in one Action.

Thanks!

Actually, I’m seeing what Bunt is cooking up with mastery/quick shot combo and wondering if I can switch the marksman out for mastery of the crossbow?

Mastery/quick shot lets you get off two shots with 3d6 needing a 5 or 6 for success.
Marksman/quick shot lets you get off one shot with 2d6 needing a 3, 4, 5 or 6 for success.

Well, let's see ...
2d6(5,6) = 55% chance of success
2d6(3,4,5,6) = 89% chance of success
3d6(5,6) = 69% chance of success
Two shots using 3d6(5,6) gives a 90% chance of landing one hit and a 49% chance of two hits.

So ...
If you absolutely have to make at least one hit, you're better off with mastery/quick shot. Plus you have basically a 50/50 chance of landing two hits, which marksman/quick shot doesn't even allow.

Yeah, I'd ask for the swap, too. 🙂

On the other hand, @Psybermagi isn't stingy with XP, so you'll get the chance for whichever one you are missing before too long, anyway.

lol, I should just ask you in the future! I asked some math friends of mine and they said:

Option A has a probability of 19/27 ~= 0.703 for successful attack on a given turn. For direct comparison with Option B, Option A has a probability of 665/729 ~= 0.912 for *at least one* successful attack over *two turns*.

Option B has a probability of 4/6 ~= 0.667 for a *one* successful attack over *two turns*.

I think Option A is optimal in any circumstance.



AND


Depends how desperate you are.

(A). For every d6 roll you have 33% chance of a hit. Three rolls with 33% chance should (in probability) land you at least one hit. Plus, you get to do that twice. It seems likelier to hit more often than (B). (But then I just rolled three dice in an app and it's not consistent).

With option (B), you have a higher 66% chance of hitting once out of every two opportunities, which seems less effective. (However, you're more likely to hit when you do make an attack roll, but it's slower.)

So ...how desperate are you?



Option A is mastery, B is marksman

Then they said:

And you can't do that with Option B. In short, this game favors those who do not focus.

I would amend that to say, "This game favors those who do not focus *in combat*." If you are not in a time crunch (like combat), focus away! The only other exception is if you have to succeed on one roll. So, for example, if I need to succeed in one roll, like with activating a scroll (my character is a sorcerer), then I will indeed focus in combat. It can also be useful for anyone using a heavy weapon (who only get one attack roll per turn regardless). But if my character was an archer, no, I probably never focus with my bow.

The Marksman trait really comes into its own, and can be really valuable, if you are in a game that uses "heavy ranged weapons". Tiny Dungeons doesn't have that, so Marksman is a bit gimped as a result. On the other hand, I'd give a lot to get a trait that gave my character the equivalent of Marksman for magic!

Yeah! My friends are suggesting that the mastery option is too OP. Happy to keep what I’ve got unless it’s okay to swap Marksman out for Mastery?

There's also berserker which could be considered.

On the very first turn, you could focus and berserk, giving you a 4/6 (67%) chance of dealing 2 damage. In contrast, quickshot+mastery has 19/27 (70%) chance for each shot, so their average damage on the first turn is similar. On the second turn, you still have the problem of reloading though, but the perk is that you can use berserk whenever you're gonna get disadvantage anyway (If you attack an enemy that is on your face with a ranged weapon you get disadvantage, right? Or is it simply not possible? I need to clear that out. )

Another thing to consider: if you do take Berserker, it won't combo too well with mastery later on (3d6 with disadvantage still becomes 1d6). HOWEVER, you're a Duende, so you could consider taking Opportunist after you take quickshot.



Unless I'm mistaken, you could take the Opportunist attack with Berserker, since you already have disadvantage anyway. Plus, since you're Duende, you have a nice chance of the enemy failing their hit.

Quichshot 2 attacks
Master advantage 3d6 5,6
Marksman standard 2d6 4,5,6

Master Quick 70% x2. Not available
Master Marksman 87% hit x1
Marksman Quick 75 % x2

Sorry, I don't let anyone start with mastery. So it is either marksman and mastery or marksman and quickshot

Ps I realized my earlier math was off so removed it and posted correction here

Check out yourself on https://anydice.com/

Ohhh cool, okay all of this makes sense! I’ll look into the traits some more, but, where are you finding the descriptions for the traits?

Marksman quick would just mean you can ultra-focus to get success on 3 4 5 6 and always follow with a load-n-attack, right? That would be 8/9 (89%) chance of hitting once every turn

(8/9 because each dice in the 2d6 has a probability of 1/3 for rolling 1 or 2, so the probability that both roll 1 or 2 [failure probability] is 1/9, and the complement of that [success probability] is 8/9)

Probably from the Tiny Dungeons 2e book. You can get it from DriveThruRPG. Ooo. The PDF is even on sale right now for 40% off! If you are interested in Tiny D6, it's a really good entry point for just $11.

(Unsponsored advertisement is now over ...)

:D okay cool. Thanks!!

Alright, I think I’ll go with Quick Shot. Can I take weapon mastery next time I lvl up or however that works?

Psybermagi awards XP as the adventure progresses. It costs 8 XP to get a new weapon group or master of a weapon. It costs 10 XP to get a new trait. (You can spend 6 XP for +1 HP, but your better better bet is the Tough trait for 10 XP for +2 HP.)

Nice! I think I might try for weapon mastery next, then tough. Awesome!

Since I have advantage now from my weapon mastery, would it make sense to go Dark fighter into Assassin? That way I’d pretty much always have Advantage, then I’d always do 2 damage. And when I have disadvantage, I’d use the death attack.

That is a very, very valid path. In fact, that is a great way to use a required trait to synergize with the prestige trait. I like where your head is at!

A not on how I run thing in this game. Dwarven darkvision is the only way to "see" in darkness. Darkfighter works in close range and some times near. Ranged weapons don't work in close. So if someone is running away, making noise, you could shoot them without seeing them as long as they are not too close or too far away

Ohhh, so dark fighter isn’t very good for ranged? Would it be better to go Sneaky into Assassin?

Both work, just letting you know of limitations. The darkmantle are dark fighters. If you have a dark bomb then it is very useful combo

I wasn't thinking of Dark-Fighter as being able to "see" in darkness. Rather, I was thinking of it as a way to maintain Advantage in more combat situations. So, like against the Darkmantles, you would not only avoid the Disadvantage from their dark clouds, but maintain your Weapon Mastery Advantage in your attacks. So, it gives many more situations where you can fight with Advantage, thereby giving more attacks that deal 2 points of damage. And since you have to take it to get Assassin, so much the better!

However, if you are not fighting in darkness, but merely wandering around in darkness, you're gonna be just as bumbling as any other non-Dwarf.

Ohhhh, no I don’t care about dark vision. I was thinking about removing disadvantage while fighting in the dark for exactly the reasons you stated.

But would it only remove disadvantage at close and near range?

Oh, where do we have prestige traits information? I was kind of waiting for an official list of approved prestige traits for here

Check the reference page. There’s a Trait thread now. The Heritage traits aren’t added yet.

So the Dark Fighter trait flavor is kind of like:
you are used to fighting in the dark and are able to use your senses to hone in on enemies’ exact location despite not being able to see them properly. And this doesn’t apply to invisible enemies, just to those in darkness.

Niice. I wonder what kind of mechanics I could expect from the animal companion of the archdruid...

Oh man! Exciting ideas!

It works on invisible. Trade off vs dwarven darkvision

Oh dang, that’s incredible! So does it take disadvantage due to darkness away at range?

you can fight melee without disadvantage. Ranged attacks, at Near range 25-50' only, there has to be something to let you target. Talking, fighting, moving without stealth . . . . One of your senses has to have something for you to target. I do not allow any ranged attack without vision normally and force disadvantage on reduced visibility. So With Darkfighter you may be able to ignore that ranged disadvantage but if you don't know they are there or where they are at all you can not attack a target. Think of it as a watered down version of Daredevil/Spider-man's abilities to tarted things without direct sight

Oh, gotcha. So it wouldn’t remove disadvantage at less than 50’. And I’d always need to sense something even at less than 50’?

And you can not use ranged attacks at 0-25', but that seems like a good option to add to the prestige class

Yes, that sounds fun!

And what if we can use ranged attacks, but at disadvantage? Or is that asking too much?

If Grin started raising one of these giant spider babies, would I need to learn beast speech for it to understand me or are they sentient enough to learn common on their own? Like, could I raise it as a pet and then eventually have a giant spider pet or would I need to go the Arch Druid route?

Can you train dogs? I guess it depends on how smart they are and how their memory works, you you just burned all their friends, etc. There is a druid path that commands creatures and yes it does require beast speech

True. I’m starting to see Grinfletch as a bit of a cave Druid. He’d like to be a little more friendly with cave beasties. Dungeoneer is a kind of ranger-like trait. I wonder if it could be connected to something with beasts through a prestige trait? Or maybe dungeoneer could connect to arch Druid as well? Maybe that’s asking too much.

I’ll have to think more about Grin’s progression. Maybe he won’t do dark fighter and will instead go the way of a Ranger/druid? I’ll take another look at the traits list.

The prerequisite for Archdruid is Beastspeaker. It kinda makes sense, so I doubt that'd change. And Archdruid is a prestige trait, so if you take it, you can't take any other. On the other hand, you can take Archdruid multiple times, gaining a beastie buddy each time. So, it is pretty cool!

And those choices don't have to be either/or, just which order you want to take them in.

Gotcha. Good points! I’m imagining Grin becoming someone who can travel through the underdark and basically get along with most folks and become friendly with most creatures that are somewhat intelligent. So like a cave Druid. Would it make sense to take beast speech and dark fighter and leave both those options open for the prestige traits?

On your question, it depends. If you don't know for sure what you want, getting both of those, then figuring out what prestige trait you want later makes perfect sense. On the other hand, if you know what direction you want to go, there's no time like the present!

I will say that the utility of both traits is situational, dependent on the adventure. Skeeve has Beastspeaker, but has only used it twice. But when he last used it, it was glorious (along with Charismatic). You need to be running into actual animals for it to get used. (Not goblins, undead, aberrations, oozes, and things like that.) For Blindfighter, you have to be (temporarily) blinded for it to matter. So it all depends on what you think you're gonna face and how you see your character.

Which is all to say, do what seems to make the most sense. The great thing about Tiny D6 is that even making a mistake in picking a trait isn't the end. Just get a different one next time. Your starting character was perfectly viable, and even a bad trait still makes them a little better than that. This is a very forgiving system.

Good advice! Much appreciated!

Happy to migrate

Questions for the GMs:

- What kinds of minor illusions are we talking about with the Belt of Trickery? Like the cantrip minor illusion from DND?

- from the first haul of crystals we got way back during the spider cave thing, there was a splitting up of all the crystal bits and I have some of the really small ones: "12.75x lbs of small 1/16" crystal fragments." What can I do with that? Is it worth anything? I had written down that: "On their own they are as useful as a lump of unforged mithril."

- Also, what does the Blessed Mask look like? And the Belt of Trickery. Should I just make that up?

About like dnd yes. Illusions of tiny objects and sounds.

The crystal fragments are like diamond dust. Used in crafting magic items. Still out of is out on rituals

You can make up the appearance

Okay great. So like diamond dust for the crystal fragments - should I price them like that too? Would Valpip buy it?

So minor illusion images can only be tiny objects. What about duration and range? And do folks need to make an INT check to determine they are fake? Here is the cantrip description I’m referencing.


Minor Illusion
Source: Player's Handbook

Illusion cantrip

Casting Time: 1 action
Range: 30 feet
Components: S, M (a bit of fleece)
Duration: 1 minute

You create a sound or an image of an object within range that lasts for the duration. The illusion also ends if you dismiss it as an action or cast this spell again.

If you create a sound, its volume can range from a whisper to a scream. It can be your voice, someone else’s voice, a lion’s roar, a beating of drums, or any other sound you choose. The sound continues unabated throughout the duration, or you can make discrete sounds at different times before the spell ends.

If you create an image of an object—such as a chair, muddy footprints, or a small chest—it must be no larger than a 5-foot cube 1-foot cube?. The image can’t create sound, light, smell, or any other sensory effect. Physical interaction with the image reveals it to be an illusion, because things can pass through it.

If a creature uses its action to examine the sound or image, the creature can determine that it is an illusion with a successful Intelligence (Investigation) check against your spell save DC. If a creature discerns the illusion for what it is, the illusion becomes faint to the creature.

All minor magic are instantaneous or have a duration of 1 round. So if you want it to persist you must use 1 action each round to maintain it. Range is close, so 25'.
A save or standard test will reveal the illusion. But only if they're is a reason to try

Thanks! I’ll add that to the description in my inventory.

Also, I found this about ore in Dungeon of the Mad Mage
Page 35: mithral ore chunks, worth 25 gp at 10 lb. each (1 lb. = 25 sp)

Does that sound reasonable? Can I sell that to Valpip/Fiznik? It would come to 31.88GP for 12.75lbs of crystal bits.

Yeah that sounds fine

Thanks

Putting this here so I don’t forget about it.

Traits to take:
-Weapon Specialization (Crossbow)
-Martial Savant (Ranged)

Actually, question for GM: is Weapon Specialization a prestige trait? I’ve got a lot of saving up XP in that case.

Weapon specialization is a regular trait

Cool, thanks! It makes sense for me to go with weapon specialization, right? If every shot of mine is at focus and I have marksman too, then every shot is a hit at 3+. Then I get two 3d6 attacks per turn that hit on 3+. My only challenge is close range fighting.

What, being awsome at 1 thing sint enough for you?!? Just don't let them get close :P

:D
True! And he has some evading capacity and a little whip!

It's not the size, or the fact it is limp, it's how you use it

lol - I just got this joke. :D

I must have been channeling my teenage son :)

Inside of each of us is a teenager rolling their eyes.

I’ll be on a work trip Sunday-Friday next week, so, I’ll probably be slow to respond. Will do my best!

No problem! Grin and Havok will fine when you get back.

I’m on vacation until next Saturday. Will post as often as possible. Grin can be distracted with the goat :)