Winter our discontent (OOC)

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Apr 4, 2025 2:53 pm
Drgwen says:
... I know Persephone will want to get together with Wentworth ASAP. ...
Same point as above, once we split up it can be hard to get back together, this is true in 'real life' for the characters, but even more true in PbP where pacing makes it real hard to end scenes simultaneously.

The indication [ref] was that we hit up Wentworth after you and Emma (and possibly Benji (and Bev?)) look for loopholes [ref].

If we want to split up first, then we can do that. Else we can try spend a few hours doing research and then speak to Sarah and Wentworth (and then Zhiyu) separately?
Drgwen says:
... in the next day or two she has committed to a sisters day. ...
We should try to shape it such that everyone gets a day of (mostly) downtime 'tomorrow' (that was the promise, not 'in the next day or two':), or at least avoid too much time slippage while such commitments are underway. But this is not a big deal if it does not work out.
Drgwen says:
... help Kat if possible, and of course participate in Emma's efforts ...
I actually never intended for us to do the weekend at the beach-house, since it is (presumably) outside the area the game covers (and Urban Shadows does not like us wandering away:). This is not a problem, if we decide to take them up on their offer, something —the weather most likely— will move their meeting somewhere more appropriate.

We can see if Persephone can wangle an invite, but a more likely scenario might see her as a 'fast reaction force', ready to swoop in and save the day. What say we all?
Apr 4, 2025 2:54 pm
Delirium says:
... weekend retreat ... if she can bring her husband with her. ...
For real? If you want him mixed in this we can swing an invite, sure.
Apr 4, 2025 3:07 pm
vagueGM says:
Same point as above, once we split up it can be hard to get back together, this is true in 'real life' for the characters, but even more true in PbP where pacing makes it real hard to end scenes simultaneously.

The indication [ref] was that we hit up Wentworth after you and Emma (and possibly Benji (and Bev?)) look for loopholes [ref].

If we want to split up first, then we can do that. Else we can try spend a few hours doing research and then speak to Sarah and Wentworth (and then Zhiyu) separately?
I am happy to stick together for the next scene and split up later!
vagueGM says:
We can see if Persephone can wangle an invite, but a more likely scenario might see her as a 'fast reaction force', ready to swoop in and save the day. What say we all?
Sisters day during our tomorrow downtime scenes and Persephone would likely enjoy being on a "fast reaction team"... Like a demonic SWAT team dropping through a skylight to save the day or something!
Apr 4, 2025 3:12 pm
I'm OK with looking for the loophole in Pers contract first, and delaying everything else for later.

vagueGM says:
We can see if Persephone can wangle an invite, but a more likely scenario might see her as a 'fast reaction force', ready to swoop in and save the day. What say we all?
that is assuming something will go wrong and Emma will find herself in trouble. I would prefer not to start a scene already knowing how it would end.
vagueGM says:
For real? If you want him mixed in this we can swing an invite, sure.
I would like to keep it as an option for now. I'm also thinking it's time for Emma to tell her husband about the existence of the supernatural world.
Apr 4, 2025 4:29 pm
Delirium says:
... that is assuming something will go wrong and Emma will find herself in trouble. ...
Um... Have you met Emma? :)
Delirium says:
... I would prefer not to start a scene already knowing how it would end. ...
Fair. What about if Emma learned there was a chance she might need backup and planned for it? Surely she knows this is not just a social thing? She can have Persephone on speed dial for in case. Or, we can have Persephone learn about danger there, and try contact Emma with a warning. Either way we can have the tackle the problem from two directions.

We can leave this till when it happens. What you learn in the meantime may shape what plans you make. All we need know is that there is risk there, but we know that, we know they are up to no good.
Delirium says:
... I would like to keep it as an option for now. I'm also thinking it's time for Emma to tell her husband about the existence of the supernatural world. ...
We can wait till the scene happens and then see what Emma does, based on what she learns. We can easily say she arranged for David to tag along —maybe without Henry's knowledge? You can decide closer to the time if you still want to bring him or need to persuade him to stay away.

It might depend on how you want David to learn about the supernatural.
Apr 4, 2025 4:58 pm
vagueGM says:
She can have Persephone on speed dial for in case. Or, we can have Persephone learn about danger there, and try contact Emma with a warning. Either way we can have the tackle the problem from two directions.
That would put Pers on standby, and she might end up not participating at the scene at all. I would much rather have her there to begin with. Maybe we can 'consolidate' the demonic cult with Per's demon benefactor, or Pers could be there because the two demons want to coordinate their activities as part of some greater plot.
vagueGM says:
You can decide closer to the time if you still want to bring him or need to persuade him to stay away.
Yes, Emma will be sorta conflicted about it, because on one hand she wouldn't want to expose him to danger, but on the other, it will be hard to make up an excuse for being away for the entire weekend, and it might strain their relationship. We will see how it goes.
vagueGM says:
It might depend on how you want David to learn about the supernatural.
A conversation, followed up with actual evidence and proof. Likely she will ask Chablis to help her with it.
Apr 4, 2025 5:21 pm
Delirium says:
... That would put Pers on standby, and she might end up not participating at the scene at all. ...
That could happen. We could always find something she needs to do, so you both need to tackle the issue from two fronts.
Delirium says:
... I would much rather have her there to begin with. ...
We can easily do that, even if she is not invited to your actual event.
Delirium says:
... Maybe we can 'consolidate' the demonic cult with Per's demon benefactor ...
Persephone has no way out of her arrangement, she can not act against her Dark Patron (not without impunity, at least), so we agreed it would be better if these guys —who are a problem Emma is dealing with, and not an asset for her— be arrayed against Persephone so she can act against them rather than for/with them. We need Emma to be able to work with Persephone.

It is simple to have Wentworth order Persephone to 'go there and hinder their activities'. That gives her a reason to be there if we don't already have one. Maybe Emma mentions the retreat so Persephone can mention it to Wentworth in passing?
Delirium says:
... Emma will be sorta conflicted ... she wouldn't want to expose him to danger, but ... hard to make up an excuse for being away for the entire weekend ...
Emma might believe she is can handle it. 'It will be fine.' And take the risk of bringing him. Others might believe it is a bigger risk and decide to be 'there' as well, maybe in a neighbouring chalet?
Delirium says:
... A conversation, followed up with actual evidence and proof. ...
Sounds like a plan. Do you, maybe, have the conversation before you go, or at the weekend retreat when you realise things will get hairy? The evidence and proof can happen there either way. You can decide closer to the time.
Delirium says:
... Likely she will ask Chablis to help her with it. ...
Possibly. I am not sure Chablis is a reliable source of that proof, we can come back to it if the weekend does not give you what you need?
Apr 4, 2025 6:13 pm
OK, I got it, and I totally agree; we want Emma to be able to work with Pers. Lets see how it goes once we actually reach that scene.

For now, Emma will 'hit the streets' to find someone with knowledge of demons. I would prefer @Drgwen creates a suitable NPC for this, since she’s familiar with the demons in this game and the kind of person who might have information about them. I got the impression they’re not quite 'biblical,' so a priest or holy man might not be the best fit.
Apr 5, 2025 3:42 am
OK, so Hit the Streets is a Circle Move, so I have to make an NPC from a Circle. How about the Scholar? They are from Power, and they seem like the type to know a lot about demons, yeah?

Off the top of my head:

Yasmine Deneuve
50-something French woman with the look of a librarian, but covered in occult tattoos.

She owns a rare books shop in Bookseller's Row (which is a real, and cool, place in London) called The Devil's Bargain. She has a private collection of infernalist tomes, as well as an arcane network of collectors and occultists with similar interests.
Apr 5, 2025 8:39 am
Drgwen says:
... so Hit the Streets is a Circle Move ...
Yes, which also means it is one of the Moves that counts towards your Advancement. So think about which Circle you need to Mark when deciding who to go to. As the book says:
page 87 says:
Hitting the streets is also an excellent way to mark a Circle for advancement; you don't have to have a Debt or an established onscreen relationship with someone to pay them a visit and ask for a favor. Haven't been able to mark Wild this session? Perhaps a visit to a faerie queen might get you what you need…
But, remember that they need to be willing to provide you the help. The Move does not deal with getting them to do it, just with whether they are available, existing relationships or negotiation are often required to actually get something from them, and this needs to be feasible (though it does not need to be a sure thing) before the Move can be rolled.
Drgwen says:
... so I have to make an NPC from a Circle. ...
Well, anyone who can interact with the Moves is from a Circle. And you can reuse existing NPCs if anyone makes sense. The other players made a number of NPCs, but we never really saw most of them in play before those player characters left the story, we can let those NPCs fade into the background so as to avoid cluttering up the roster.
Drgwen says:
... How about the Scholar? ...
The Scholar as in the Playbook? Playbooks are for PCs, don't worry about them for NPCs, NPCs don't have Playbooks and are not special like PCs are, they are also much more freeform and versatile. Feel free to use the Playbooks for inspiration, of course, and to see what sorts fall into what Circle. You can always make something similar to a Playbook.
Drgwen says:
... Yasmine Deneuve (Power): 50-something French woman with the look of a librarian, but covered in occult tattoos. ...
Sounds great.

• Does Persephone know of Yasmine? Or do you need someone to send you there?

If we want, we can try strategize and get the most out of our spree.

If Benji is with you, there are (multiple) reasons he might know about Yasmine and her shop. But one of his contacts (maybe a scholar from Mortails) might fill in the gaps that she is particularly well suited to answer the sorts of questions you have. That way he can Mark off Mortalis and Power and join the group and benefit as well.
@oopsylon: Is Benji going with the ladies on this quest?

• Only one person rolls Hit the Streets, but everyone else might be able to roll Put a Face to a Name the first time. Others could Hit the Streets with that NPC for something else while you are there, but it can get incongruous and messy, so I might not recommend it.

It can never be perfect, and Emma already has Mortalis and Power, but that puts you all on the a similar level and we can then try coordinate, but it can get out of hand too. The story comes first, but the ordering of the story can be guided by the need for Circle Marks.

@Drgwen: Don't forget to record your Marked Circles on your sheet so we can all see which you have and which you need and plan accordingly. You should have, at least, Wild Marked from the Job you did on Howard Winters.
Apr 5, 2025 8:51 am
vagueGM says:
@oopsylon: Is Benji going with the ladies on this quest?
Sure, Benji will come along! Jacob’s shop is in Cecil Court too, right? So it stands to reason that Benji would know of Yasmine or at least would have seen her shop in passing. Maybe Benji could be the one who recommends they pay Yasmine a visit?
Apr 5, 2025 8:57 am
oopsylon says:
... Jacob’s shop is in Cecil Court too, right? ...
Indeed. The 'demon knowledgeable' occultist who runs a bookshop in the same street as your demon friend's bookshop... Yeah, you will know of her. :)

Do you know her through Jacob? Or do you want to use the advice above to maximise your Advancement? Up to you. Either way it seems like you should roll Put a Name to a Face (when we get there) to work out the nature of your relationship which will factor into how willing she is to help.
Apr 5, 2025 10:17 am
I’m not too fussed about optimising advancement. I think it makes the most sense for Benji to know Yasmine through Jacob
Apr 5, 2025 10:29 am
oopsylon says:
I’m not too fussed about optimising advancement. ...
Cool. Just reminding the players, as I have seen players get salty when they keep missing opportunities.
oopsylon says:
... I think it makes the most sense for Benji to know Yasmine through Jacob
We can jump to the shop. Someone can describe what it is like. Maybe Benji suggested Yasmine as a source, or maybe someone else knew her as well.

Benji and Emma can roll Put a Face to a Name which might suggest who comes up with the idea to go there? Persephone can roll too, if we think Yasmine might be someone mentioned to her as 'problem', though I don't see Debts being involved there.

Presumably Persephone is the one rolling Hit the Streets? But we can mix it up based on who makes the most sense in the fiction.
Apr 5, 2025 10:46 am
vagueGM says:
The Scholar as in the Playbook?
Wait, there is a Scholar playbook?? I was trying to find which playbook Emma will eventually transition to (since there is no way for the Aware to safely 'retire'), and haven't found anything that would fit so far. Are there any others?

Rolling 'put a face to a name' doesn't make sense to start with, because all Emma has are the names, without the faces.
But she can maybe 'Hit the Streets', and others can Put a Face to a Name later?
Apr 5, 2025 11:15 am
Delirium says:
... there is a Scholar playbook?? ...
There are additional playbooks that are not part of the core book. Many of them change the rules in ways that don't always work in regular games, and I think there was advice in 1e to not include more than one at a time unless you really know what you are doing.
Delirium says:
... trying to find which playbook Emma will eventually transition to ...
The Scholar may be a fit for Emma and does not change the world in ways that are a problem. It may put you at odds with Amira and her clan, unless you can work out how to live in harmony with them.
Delirium says:
... Are there any others? ...
They were called 'Limited Edition Playbooks' in 1e, but I don't know what they are calling them in 2e.

We can talk about each of the 'extra' playbooks that you are interested in, see how they fit and if we need to make preemptive changes to the world to bring them in.
Delirium says:
... Rolling 'put a face to a name' doesn't make sense to start with, because all Emma has are the names, without the faces. ...
Uh, yeah... you have a name, now you can put a face to it. But it may not really benefit you much to roll here if you don't know them.

Also, why can't you know Yasmine, she is a book seller in your neighborhood. Maybe you did not know she was in the know... but if you have met her you might have a pretty good idea, so she may be who you were thinking of suggesting when you proposed this plan.
Delirium says:
... doesn't make sense to start with ... and others can Put a Face to a Name later? ...
You can only 'Put an x to an x' the first time you encounter an NPC, you can not save it for later. It is to establish what you already knew.
Delirium says:
... But she can maybe 'Hit the Streets' ...
You could do, and should do if that is what makes the most sense in the fiction... but you won't benefit from rolling that and that will rob Persephone of Marking Power. Emma might know the Power Circle a bit better than Persephone does, but Persephone actually knows what going on, it is her questions. Who rolls will change the fiction and change what is asked for in return.
Apr 5, 2025 12:10 pm
I will roll 'put a name to a face' then, assuming Emma passed by The Devil's Bargain in the past, and now when she sees Yasmine's name in her contact list, she will make the connection.

Regarding the playbook, I’m still not sure which direction Emma will go. The Scholar is a good fit, but she might also be tempted to make a deal to 'live forever.' Becoming a vampire is becoming less appealing the more she learns about their weaknesses and condition, so maybe some other supernatural creature. Anyway, I'll see how it all unfolds. Right now I'm happy with playing the Aware.
Apr 5, 2025 12:27 pm
Delirium says:
... now when she sees Yasmine's name in her contact list ...
You don't have to pull everything from your contact list. This is quite feasibly someone you actually know, they are in the book business, and you write books (even if they are the wrong sort), you may have canvased all the book dealers in the area, or anything... or not, your call.
Delirium says:
... The Scholar is a good fit ...
Might be. Aren't they are mainly Mind playbook? (I played one once, but have not actually looked at the 2e versions of any of these:).

Emma may need to find ways to fortify her Mind Stat a bit. :)
Delirium says:
... she might also be tempted to make a deal to 'live forever.' ...
As I say, I have not looked at the Playbooks not in the core rulebook, not past the description on the Kickstarter pages, so I am not sure which ones you are alluding to. Some of them have already lived a long time, which does not match 'becoming one', but if you want to try to becomes an immortal or a deity that is fine to talk about.
Delirium says:
... Becoming a vampire is becoming less appealing ...
The more you learn about any of them the more you realise why most people are people and don't take the deals. :)
I wonder if Emma will notice that, and that just because she has only learned about the downsides of vampires does not mean the others she know less about are not also similarly encumbered. :)

I don't know about living forever, it does not define anything about this, but Werewolf seems an interesting option for Emma?

She can maybe even end up as a Fae. Vamp/Werewolf/Fae all have ways to turn without planning on it, so let us know if the story forces this on Emma, we won't force it on the player, of course. Death could lead to one coming back as a Revenant, as well... depending on how the story goes. (I had good fun with a Revenant once.)
Apr 5, 2025 12:37 pm
vagueGM says:
You don't have to pull everything from your contact list.
Oops. Already posted before I saw your suggestion :(
Will keep it in mind for next time.
vagueGM says:
but if you want to try to becomes an immortal or a deity that is fine to talk about.
Is that actually an option? Emma is already a little vein now, becoming a deity will be like throwing gasoline over a fire.
A werewolf doesn't seem right for her (too much body hair...), though turning into something contrary to your nature can be a fun thing to roleplay too. Lets see how it goes, right now I'm not really feeling it for any of the other playbooks.
Apr 5, 2025 12:48 pm
Delirium says:
... Oops. Already posted ...
And rolled really well. No Debts since you have not met, but what special secret do your notes contain? Think about it and maybe bring it up when appropriate to help sway the meeting towards helping you.
Delirium says:
... Is that actually an option? ...
A deity? I believe so. We can look closer at the Playbooks, but as I say, I believe they are a small gods, the forgotten type. The Ancient, for instance. There is also the Angel, and the Immortal, but, as I said, they are all sorta themed as 'have always been this' rather than 'can become this', but we can make it work if that is the route we decide on.
Delirium says:
... A werewolf doesn't seem right for her (too much body hair...), ... something contrary to your nature can be a fun thing to roleplay too. ...
That contrariness was the main reason I thought of it. :)
Delirium says:
... right now I'm not really feeling it for any of the other playbooks. ...
That Advancement option is also only open to you way down the line, you need to first take 5 other Advancements, and you have none.

If the story forces such a change on you, then we don't care about the Advancement options, if you turn into a vampire you are a vampire, not a choice that needs an Advancement.
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