Heist the Colours (OOC)

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May 4, 2023 5:14 pm
vagueGM says:
Airshark says:
Lio will try to aim and shoot the guy on the rooftop.
Aiming is a Minor Action (page 75). You can spend your 1 Minor Action to Aim and then your 1 Significant Action to Shoot this Round.

You can spend up to 6 Minor Actions in a row to gain up to +6 to your Attack, though that will mean three Rounds till you Attack. You could spend all 3 Minor Actions this round and 1 the next Round and then Attack with +4 as your Significant Action that Round.
I will take the latter option. 3+1+attack.
Aiming, waiting for a good shot . Maybe for the guy to walk up to the edge of the roof.
May 5, 2023 3:42 am
WhtKnt says:
Cat is going to delay until the shooting starts, at which point she goes prone. She doesn't have a gun and doesn't particularly want to get shot.
Who does? :)

Fair chance your target might get away, though, with everyone 'not acting'.
May 5, 2023 3:44 am
Airshark says:
... Aiming, waiting for a good shot . Maybe for the guy to walk up to the edge of the roof.
He is already fairly exposed on the roof, if anything you risk having him leaving, but I don't think that is likely to happen unless things go wrong. Maybe the loud 'music' causes him to take a look over the edge?

Technically Movement and kneeling (Changing Stance) are Minor Actions, but we can assume the movement was from last time, and the kneeling was part of the Aiming.
May 5, 2023 3:48 am
@TheGenerator: Your loud Bob-Diversion has helped Lio in that his target has not moved further away and we can say he is more exposed looking over the edge (Boon).

But what is your plan for the hostage-taker? What are you hoping the surprise will do, because the noise is equally problematic for both parties.
May 5, 2023 3:49 am
Pedrop: If there is anything you still want to try with Craig before the aural assault you better get it done. :)
May 5, 2023 4:43 am
Will be able to give it my full attention in about 7-8h from now.
May 5, 2023 7:03 am
vagueGM says:
But what is your plan for the hostage-taker? What are you hoping the surprise will do, because the noise is equally problematic for both parties.
I just want to give anyone on our team an opening. For example, Raf is in a stand-off with that other person. The music could make that one look away for a second. Just enough to give Raf a window of opportunity.

It doesn't have to be a boon, it can also just be a narrative thing. Kinda like the old "Look behind you! A three-headed monkey!".
The sound doesn't have to last longer than 10 seconds, I'd say.

Edit: When I said in RP "That's sure to turn some heads!". I meant that quite literally :)
Last edited May 5, 2023 7:06 am
May 5, 2023 7:57 am
Cool.

Lio can have a Boon (since that makes sense in the fiction).

If Raf can leverage the noise to his advantage we will assess whether it is purely fictional or provides a Boon, but it could also amplify his 5 and make things worse, so it may be better if he can act before this happens (as part of the previous round).

If Ronny can use it to his own advantage, then good.

The 'music' will continue till someone (one of you or the cops, probably) tells Bob to shut up.
May 5, 2023 6:57 pm
How loud is a laser gun? Will it be heard over the music?
May 6, 2023 6:25 am
Airshark says:
How loud is a laser gun?
The rules don't say anything so we will apply 'logic'. I would think they are loud enough that someone in the same room as you would recognise it as what it is, but not loud like a Slug Thrower (bullet gun). Slug Throwers have a Suppressor (Silencer) Options to deal with their loudness, Energy Weapons don't have that as an Option, so they don't need it.
Airshark says:
Will it be heard over the music?
Not by anyyone more than a few steps away from you. You will be able to hear (and feel) that it fired, though if you were in Bob's van even you would not know.
May 7, 2023 1:52 pm
Am I correct that Lio is skipping a turn for all the minor actions.
Just to be sure no one is waiting for me 😉
May 7, 2023 9:47 pm
Ok, I have provided 2 variants for Raf actions in RP thread, as I was not sure what is the exact situation. Vague please tell me what I should roll? I should I propose something?
May 8, 2023 8:06 am
Pedrop says:
(OOC in RP)... To be honest its my 2nd evening that I'm thinking what Raf would do in this situation. ...
It seems to me this might be because you are trying to do something that really is not possible? This whole business of turning Craig into a 'friend' will take a lot of work, and many steps, and probably more time than you have on this planet.

The 5 you rolled can mean that Raf really believes that he has a connection with this man he has at gunpoint, but he is wrong. Maybe you need to stop looking for actions that might work and accept that you will fail?
Pedrop says:
(OOC in RP)... problem is that I don't know how Craig will react to the "music". ...
I was trying to give you a chance to act before the music. You have mostly missed two Rounds where you did nothing. But we can't wait much longer.

If you want the music to happen and force your action then I can do that.
Pedrop says:
(OOC in RP)... 1. Craig is distracted ...
Probably.
Pedrop says:
(in RP)... "You see. You can trust me ...
Why? Why would he see that? There is nothing in the fiction to back that up.

You can still try that, but it will not work. Why would it? I am open for you to make your case, but so far, there is nothing to make Craig think you won't shoot him as soon as he lowers his gun.

Are you saying 'because you did not shoot him when he glanced away for a second'? I am not sure there is enough there, but Raf might think so?
Pedrop says:
(OOC in RP)... variant 2. Craig didn't flinched ... Raf will do something risky ...
I think you will need to do something risky anyway, no matter whether he flinches or likes the music.
Pedrop says:
(in RP)... aiming at Craigs gun to try to disarm him ...
This might be the most expedient course of action. It could end your conflict with Craig. But Raf might still believe he can talk his way out of this.
Pedrop says:
(OOC in RP)... in "Traveller companion" ...
I don't have the Traveller Companion. I don't believe they have released one for the current version (2022 Update), so it is still for the previous (2e) version?
Pedrop says:
(OOC in RP)... aiming at specific body parts is DM-2 ...
That seems like a reasonable baseline. I would have thought that it would depend on which body part, though. But I am not sure want to do with that level of granularity.
Pedrop says:
(OOC in RP)... not sure it is the same as aiming at the hand or pistol? ...
If hand-vs-head-vs-leg is all the same, then hand-vs-pistol is similar?

However, if you are trying hard not to also hit his hand in the process, so it is a clean shot that takes out the gun without injuring him, then that surely must be harder? I don't want to say another -2, but maybe another -1? Laser Pistols are quite large, but there may be a chance it will explode if you roll really bad?
Pedrop says:
(OOC in RP)... short range +1 ...
Agreed.
Pedrop says:
(OOC in RP)... I would like to take aim short action(s) - in round before ...
You both started this encounter by taking Aim. So you get one of those 'for free'. If you tried to further focus on Aiming during your 'talks' he would react to that, surely?

That would make it:
+1 For Aiming at the start.
+1 For Short Range.
-2 For Targeted 'Hand-Shot'.
-1 For 'Only the gun'?
So a net -1 or -0.
However, he is likely to React, and jerk away from the shot. This inflicts a Penalty equal to his DEX Mod (+2), but gives him -1 to all further Actions this Round.
Then:
+0 DEX
+1 Gun Combat (Energy)
For a final -2 or -1.
Against 8+.

We can say the unexpected music gives you a Boon, so you would roll `3d6h2-2` (or -1 depending on how much you care about his hand (and his friendship)).
Aside from your two options, there is also the possibility that he takes this opportunity to react and dive out of the way, thus ending your 'stalemate' situation.

I can do that if you want me to, but don't want to take away your option of trying your ideas.
May 8, 2023 8:38 am
For now I will only address this part, at (my) evening I will post answers to all the other subjects:
vagueGM says:
Pedrop says:
(in RP)... "You see. You can trust me ...
Why? Why would he see that? There is nothing in the fiction to back that up.
What I meant by that was (all acting under assumption that music has distracted Craig and he turned his head) : "you see, you didn't looked at me for a sec and I didn't shoot you, but I could". I think it is not necessarily a but argument... for some trust :)

The rest subjects: later.
May 8, 2023 8:54 am
Pedrop says:
... "you see, you didn't looked at me for a sec and I didn't shoot you, but I could". I think it is not necessarily a but argument... for some trust ...
That presupposes that he knows that you were not also surprised, and that he knows that you chose to not shoot him in the moment before he looked back. The problem with your party communicating privately is that the others don't know these details, they can only act based on their understanding of the world.

You can try that route. But it will be Formidable (14+) to get him to believe you.

Or we can roll against Average (8+) and use the Effect Level to judge how much this shifts his 'Attitude'. He is currently a 'reluctant enemy', with a gun pointed and aimed at you. Shifts in Attitude could be: 'he keeps his gun up, but not pointed/aimed directly at you', 'he lowers his gun but does not put it away', 'he holsters his gun but watches you warily', 'he backs away from the fight'; and so on.

You would need to sell it in the fiction.
May 9, 2023 7:31 am
vagueGM says:
It seems to me this might be because you are trying to do something that really is not possible? This whole business of turning Craig into a 'friend' will take a lot of work, and many steps, and probably more time than you have on this planet.
Probably it is not possible. As player I agree:) But my view on the subject is this: in the situation that one have gun pointed at their guts... it probably is not the dumbest thing to ask few thinks before start shooting. Even if the probability of changing situation is low.

Besides... I hope, I will phrase it correctly... it sometimes looks to me as you are acting as you would like to establish beforehand how NPC will react to my actions with me... but probably it is more in the vein of informing me what will be consequences of Raf action... so... from one side: thank you for that. But from other, sometimes it feels that if Raf is trying to do something "impossible"(not logical, or even not good for story)... maybe we don't have to establish it beforehand and you could just provide me with the result of his actions? Just my thoughts. I think it's part of the fun - just watching how world would react, not necessarily "negotiating" the effect with it(GM in this case). Even, if the action is something stupid... there would/should be harsh response from the world... I think:)

Edit: after writing the rest of this post, I think I understand better what you are doing... I think you mostly try to provide me opportunities to fully do what I wanted in fiction and making my PC act according to his real personality("come alive"). What would be most wonderful IR game, but maybe it is just my impatience and PbP nature that is less fit for this? So probably you should ignore the previous paragraph, at it was just my impatience... but I decided to leave it here... because I'm unsure if it is completely not useful... ???
vagueGM says:
The 5 you rolled can mean that Raf really believes that he has a connection with this man he has at gunpoint, but he is wrong. Maybe you need to stop looking for actions that might work and accept that you will fail?
No problem with that. Failing, trying(and learning from it... :) ) is a part of life. Just say how Raf failed, add Craig reaction reflecting this - and lets move on:)
vagueGM says:
I was trying to give you a chance to act before the music. You have mostly missed two Rounds where you did nothing. But we can't wait much longer.
Yes. I know. Nothing against your approach:) Was completely reasonable. But "now" we have music on, so I wondered if that changed the situation somehow for Raf and I should take it into consideration, or not?
vagueGM says:
If you want the music to happen and force your action then I can do that.
But maybe I'm wrong? At it didn't happen "in Raf timeline", yet? :)
vagueGM says:
Pedrop says:
(in RP)... "You see. You can trust me ...
Why? Why would he see that? There is nothing in the fiction to back that up.

You can still try that, but it will not work. Why would it? I am open for you to make your case, but so far, there is nothing to make Craig think you won't shoot him as soon as he lowers his gun.

Are you saying 'because you did not shoot him when he glanced away for a second'? I am not sure there is enough there, but Raf might think so?
Sorry, that last question stated here indicated that you did understand my intent - so my previous post wasn't necessary(was written hastily) then.

Raf thought that way, that not shooting him when he look away is enough. If it is not - no problem for me. Just say how Craig reacted.
vagueGM says:
Pedrop says:
(OOC in RP)... in "Traveller companion" ...
I don't have the Traveller Companion. I don't believe they have released one for the current version (2022 Update), so it is still for the previous (2e) version?
I think so too.
Quote:
However, if you are trying hard not to also hit his hand in the process, so it is a clean shot that takes out the gun without injuring him, then that surely must be harder? I don't want to say another -2, but maybe another -1? Laser Pistols are quite large, but there may be a chance it will explode if you roll really bad?
Yes. Raf tries - a little - just to shoot at Craig's gun only, to keep his word of not intending to harm him(but also not ding in the process), I think it should be harder then aiming at arm or even head. So another -1(-3 total) seems good to me. Exploding after one shoot? Is it really so unreliable? Some collateral damage would seem more appropriate... (where is this GJ guy...? ;) )
Quote:
That would make it:
+1 For Aiming at the start.
+1 For Short Range.
-2 For Targeted 'Hand-Shot'.
-1 For 'Only the gun'?
So a net -1 or -0.
However, he is likely to React, and jerk away from the shot. This inflicts a Penalty equal to his DEX Mod (+2), but gives him -1 to all further Actions this Round.
Then:
+0 DEX
+1 Gun Combat (Energy)
For a final -2 or -1.
Against 8+.

We can say the unexpected music gives you a Boon, so you would roll `3d6h2-2` (or -1 depending on how much you care about his hand (and his friendship)).
I like your reasoning! -2 that will be. Raf is sooo friendly... shady smuggler, with dark past... ;);)
So should I assume that we go with variant 2 and add my roll to the post?
vagueGM says:
Aside from your two options, there is also the possibility that he takes this opportunity to react and dive out of the way, thus ending your 'stalemate' situation.

I can do that if you want me to, but don't want to take away your option of trying your ideas.
I like your calculations:) And like idea of possibility to disarm him... and then show him that Raf is the man of his world... taking into consideration that if he will miss... there will be consequences:)
May 9, 2023 7:36 am
vagueGM says:
Pedrop says:
... "you see, you didn't looked at me for a sec and I didn't shoot you, but I could". I think it is not necessarily a but argument... for some trust ...
That presupposes that he knows that you were not also surprised, and that he knows that you chose to not shoot him in the moment before he looked back. The problem with your party communicating privately is that the others don't know these details, they can only act based on their understanding of the world.

You can try that route. But it will be Formidable (14+) to get him to believe you.

Or we can roll against Average (8+) and use the Effect Level to judge how much this shifts his 'Attitude'. He is currently a 'reluctant enemy', with a gun pointed and aimed at you. Shifts in Attitude could be: 'he keeps his gun up, but not pointed/aimed directly at you', 'he lowers his gun but does not put it away', 'he holsters his gun but watches you warily', 'he backs away from the fight'; and so on.

You would need to sell it in the fiction.
You are right. It's all highly unbelievable. Probably he didn't even looked away, as there was still his life on the line? So let's go with the variant 2.
May 9, 2023 8:52 am
@Pedrop: I will try to sum up rather than reply to each point (especially since some of them were retracted:).

We will learn each others' styles as we play, so this will get smoother with time.

I don't know what you are trying to do till you tell me, so it can be hard to 'just provide you with the result of your actions'.

I also don't want to assume that any mistakes made are mistakes your character would make and not misunderstandings on the player's part. Raf knows things about the world that Pedrop (and the players, including myself) does not know, so he is less likely to make some sorts of mistakes.

In terms of the music being in Raf's 'timeline': I am sorry for any confusion, I was trying to give you the opportunity to do something before the music came, because you had essentially missed two turns with your being away and the discussion-interrupted. That didn't work, and I will adjust/expedite my approach going forward.

In terms of IR vs PbP, you are right, such negotiation can take a long time. I will try to be clear with options going forward, but will also not give as much time to later discussions. I am still trying to get a feel for how you express your intentions. I can only act on the intentions you express to me. Feel free to use the OCC to make your intentions clear if there is any ambiguity in the RP. I will ask once when they are not clear and then move on, usually with the least impactfull assumption to minimise unexpected consequences, these are not 'the most fun' but I don't have license to make your character look like a fool, only you can do that if you so choose.

I will post a minor reaction from Craig, then please post a proper, singular response with your actual actions. Schrodinger's Posts with multiple potential actions will get confusing and are better suited to OOC.
May 10, 2023 4:16 am
To shoot the guy on the rooftop

2d6+skill(1)+dex(0)
Long range -2
Aiming+1?
Bob's musical boon +1?
Last edited May 10, 2023 4:16 am
May 10, 2023 7:57 am
Airshark says:
To shoot the guy on the rooftop

2d6+skill(1)+dex(0)
Long range -2
Aiming+1?
...
That looks correct.
Airshark says:
... Bob's musical boon +1?
Boons give an extra dice, you roll three and keep the highest two. So you would roll `3d6h2+1+0-2+1`
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